Mordhau
 Oatmate
Knight
  • Likes received 30
  • Date joined 1 May '17
  • Last seen 9 Sep '19

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Knight 614 1114
  • 27 Apr '19
 Uncy

Message from dev

We are still looking into adding female characters post release as was promised, if added they will be on par with the rest of the game and implemented properly to ensure they are not a detriment to the atmosphere of the game. The voice acting especially will be crucial for this.

The realism complaint is valid, so when we add them we might add a simple client-side toggle (for both female and male characters) which would let you disable them.

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  • 27 Apr '19
 HaywireHayley

I saw a customization video a while back including a female character and I wondered whether this is still on the agenda. I've heard it's planned for after launch, but I've not heard any confirmation or seen a source, and I'm hoping it won't be too far back in the list of things to do as a few games have initially promised this only to never really deliver.

While I'll be buying the game anyway and will no doubt absolutely love it; I do really enjoy playing female characters. Creating my own Brienne of Tarth replica would be awesome. I'm sure someone will bring up the lack of female combatants during the time period, but some did exist, and that seems excuse enough to add them into what is ultimately a not-very-serious video game where people bang each other over the head with lutes.

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  • 17 May '19
 Minion

Probably the only thing that still makes no sense is the stab dragging, or the proximity for stabbing

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  • 13 Jun '19
 HalldeiMaul

Happy to see Marox posting about this.
Let's be honest - there's about 6-9 months time in which to gain an extra advantage over Chiv 2, and if by then map count, quality of life features and general development hasn't doubled, a ton of people will get sucked into Chiv 2 if is even remotely better in some aspects, and in general just because someone who likes "Games like Chiv" will obviously buy a game like Chiv. I know I will, simply because there's literally only 2 games like this on the market for me at the moment.

But let's not just fixate on the TO mode, even if I sorely wish for that as well.
If you want the game to keep living, you need to keep the community viable. That means fixing issues like spawnkilling, finally banning griefers and trolls, paying attention to reports about them, and giving the community quick and easy and reliable to use tools for that to begin with.

Since this last bit of cleanup QoL takes very little time to implement compared to building maps and modes, could we maybe rush this so that 5 nights out of 7 there aren't people placing barriers at spawns, beartraps at spawns, teamkilling etc pp?
I'm kinda running out of places where to ask for this and I know I'm not the only one who gets annoyed by playing becoming pointless because 2-3 people team up to grief the shit out of others due to having no life.
Griefers need to permanently lose access to the game, period. Its the only way to keep a community going and put up warning signs for others.

Knight 928 2545
  • 13 Jun '19
 Pred

@smellycathawk said:

@Pred said:
This much of Chivalry lore was enough tbh:

There is a kingdom
One side is loyal to the king of that kingdom
The other party wants to topple the old system. Malric is in this one.

There was a lot more subtlety to it than that. Through the context of their actions, the armor they wear, their voices and lines, the home maps of each faction. They all built on the lore

Masons were clearly more blue collar. Rough around the edges. More brutal in nature as they are likely more used to a brutal way of life, having lived on the lower rungs of feudal society until the rebellion. Their maps are industrial, darker, usually more makeshift or run-down.

Yes, teams had identity, but I spent good 4 seconds wondering if this part should count as lore, and decided it's not entirely that. But maybe it is.

Anyway, having two distinct teams was good for years of memery on reddit, though it would be hard to transfer to Mordhau because customization and voices are all available for both teams.

1111.png

Knight 26 32
  • 13 Jun '19
 Korendil

Remember when Chivalry had that map making contest? We got some good maps out of that. Would be cool to have something similar here.

I was disappointed in Crossroads as it emphasised the parts of the game I personally find the most frustrating: projectiles and horses. I was hoping it would be the more urban style maps that were teased a while back. Hopefully they'll come soon. As far as Crossroads is concerned, and as a new major map release, it only ended up making me step away from the game for a bit.

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  • 13 Jun '19
 smellycathawk

@Pred said:
This much of Chivalry lore was enough tbh:

There is a kingdom
One side is loyal to the king of that kingdom
The other party wants to topple the old system. Malric is in this one.

There was a lot more subtlety to it than that. Through the context of their actions, the armor they wear, their voices and lines, the home maps of each faction. They all built on the lore

Masons were clearly more blue collar. Rough around the edges. More brutal in nature as they are likely more used to a brutal way of life, having lived on the lower rungs of feudal society until the rebellion. Their maps are industrial, darker, usually more makeshift or run-down.

Agatha seem to be more refined white collar types. The actual lords of Agatha and their warriors. Pompous and entitled, arrogant and confident, they see themselves as righteous defenders of the peace and of their homeland. Which is a bountiful land of shiny castles and innocent villages. Which they have no interest in sharing.

When you think "Agatha", you can have a decent picture of what the land and its people are like, which is something unique about a multi-player experience with essentially no lore. Chivalry sucks you into the world in such an organic way that you don't even notice.

Mordhau puts you on a battlefield and says "that guy is wearing a different colour than you are. Kill him." And that's all we got.

Knight 12 26
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  • 13 Jun '19
 mjgardener

Many people deal with morphs and feints just fine. It takes time and skill to read them.

Knight 1388 3163
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  • 13 Jun '19
 Tim_Fragmagnet

I feel like I should also clear something else up.

I'm not bashing on the overall quality of the art and maps in the game.

This is content most likely none of us could have ever made. They're objectively pretty. But they're also generic, stale, and otherwise sub optimal.

(it's good art, it's just not the art we're looking for)

Mountain Peak is a good example. It's a pretty map, that with some blizzard effects, would be pretty fucking cool (oh my god that's a pun). The huge problem with it is that 2/3 of the entire fucking map serve no purpose and are completely pointless. "flanking" you say. What the fuck do you mean flanking when people just spend the entire game on the flanks and never capture the points.

Your maps need to complement (not compliment, look it up) your mode, and your mode needs to take advantage of everything your maps have to offer.

90% of crossroads literally serves no purpose as it's a KOTH map and should just be put into its own rotation because it's pretty much a completely different mode. The reception of crossroads would have been FAR less negative if it was introduced as a new KOTH mode.

Camp's objectives swerve in a zig-zag and create large zones of pointless TDM in the middle of the map. On top of the fact that this map takes place during the middle of the day on an open field. It's the most boring map we have in the game. Give it rain, make it darker, it will be interesting to look at then.

Taiga is actually visually interesting, it's set in interesting lighting while also having an interesting overall visual design. The problem it still has, however, it's basically just a glorified TDM map.

Grad is getting near to how a map SHOULD be. What it NEEDS, is a change in lighting, and a ram objective to bust open the gate in the castle once you clear the barricades out of the way. "but there's already big holes in the castle you could run through" Yeah, well close those up and add spawn ramps like how mountain peak has them in the side of its castle walls. "but this would make it blue sided" Yeah, well time to make team objective.

Stop setting your maps in the middle of a clear day, it's sterile. Give it clouds and rain, give it wind and have leaves being blown off trees into the middle of the battle, flashes of lightning light up the darkened battlefield, sandstorms, thick knee high mist, a fucking eclipse. ANYTHING to make it not just "another day".

Crossroads is a good test in dramatic lighting, but it's obviously way too strong because quite a few people have issues with target ID in the middle of the map.


We all love this game, and want it to become even better. And while I may seem like I'm ripping apart pointless parts of the game to make issues that aren't actually there, well. Lets put it this way.

Do you want mordhau to be a flash in the pan like the majority of games nowadays? Or do you want mordhau to keep going, and going, and going?

Again,

Chivalry's gameplay was TRASH. Yet it kept going, and going, and going. Not because it didn't have competition, but because it was exciting and engaging, DESPITE the huge flaws in its gameplay.

If Chivalry went on for as long as it did with its gameplay.

How fucking long will Mordhau go for if it gets to where it needs to be?


Also for those wondering, @crushed works on weapon balance and animations. He doesn't do any work related to this thread and doesn't matter here, he's just upset that people are laughing at him because of the heavy handaxe balance.

The devs we're looking for are:
@marox as the lead dev (he posted while I was writing this and I had to edit the whole thing god damnit)
@elwebbaro as the lead art dev
@Vesanus as the level design dev
@Grator works on maps too.

The work these devs have done as a mostly inexperienced team is incredible. There is no denying it. They just needed this push in the right direction to make Mordhau unstoppable.

Mercenary 2193 3913
  • 12 Jun '19
 EruTheTeapot

Yea so I kinda agree and don't agree with Tim.

What we are missing in the game mainly imho:

  • WHO are fighting ?
  • WHY they are fighting ?

They are fighting but what for ?
Is it for a King who just wants gold coinz or for a rebellious noble of said king to set the kingdom on the right track ?
Is it a simple invasion on a kingdom ?
Simply the answer is, we just don't know. Because there isn't a lore atm. Sure we have team names of Iron Company and Whatever the name of blue is, can't even remember it, and that they are mercenary companies.
But why are the sides in this war use mercenary companies instead of a proper organized army ?

I think we need a good lore behind the fighting scenes before the map designs or whatnot. They are content for now but their background is empty. Cause imho, nothing gives a game or any fiction product better personality than a solid, interesting lore.

Maps should have their own purposes in the lore too, why is it that we free peasants in Grad but not free any prisoners in Camp ? Could be a choice to have variations in map objectives to not be repetitive surely but then we need some reason to believe so. Maybe the owners of the camp executed the prisoners while sieging the main fortress or maybe they just don't take prisoners to begin with.

We have nothing to build the Mordhau world upon. So..

lore
lore

lore

lore

lore

lore


On the other hand, I have problems with the objectives given on maps rather than the map design itself. I don't see the hate Crossroads is getting either. Sure we have a open field and a small castle like ruins with treehouse, still not making use of the open field cause the objective is ONLY a King of The Hill type inside the ruins. Again we are in need of a lore on the map to see why its a Crossroad and why we need to capture a ruin ?

Is it on a main trade route ? Then why is it a ruin ?
If it is a ruin why do companies want to capture it ?
Why do we have 2 stables in middle of nowhere ? Its a crossroad, why don't we see any main roads leading to some interesting faraway scenery like a city in distance or a trade port ?

Sure there are minor map design flaws that don't make sense but nothing that can't be fixed we ease.

-#MakeLorehauGreatAgain

Duke 553 939
  • 12 Jun '19
 Goatie

Tim isn't wrong crush lol, take it as a criticism instead of being annoying with meme reply and cutting out a section of his quote where it makes less sense. The core mechanics are amazing but other then that Mordhau is currently Bordhau. You may be working on all this already but giving a le funny reply to legit criticism and concern does not inspire hope at all.

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  • 12 Jun '19
 Treusturm

Chiv 1 was a shit show, proven by the fact that people left it to create this awesomeness since tb wasnt doing shit. Chiv 2 trailer looks like a high school kid put it together for a class project

I guess you did not play crossroads yet, because that is the real definition of a high school kid project. I can even count the new assets for that with my fingers.

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  • 12 Jun '19
 Treusturm

@Dialectic said:
Objectively that trailer was bad. It was CGI, and poorly done CGI. The combat was likely not live gameplay but a rendering, and the hitboxes were laughably bad.

Why do you still fall for teaser trailers? Lol

You make no sense at all, if it is CGI then how do you know the hitboxes are broken lol.

The gameplay is pretty fun but I agree that they have to do something about map and objective design. I have never seen such terrible map design in a popular multiplayer game. Some people may enjoy playing only duels and scrims but that alone will not keep the game alive. If Frontline won't be improved or replaced with something better, I feel like the game will be deserted when all the hype ends.

Knight 1388 3163
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  • 12 Jun '19
 Tim_Fragmagnet

@Dialectic said:
That chiv 2 trailer looked fucking awful. Tri can rename the mercs to 2 groups of knights in like 5 seconds if need be, and I guarantee they are working on modes and maps.

That chiv 2 trailer looked more visually interesting than the entirety of mordhau's development and current life cycle. If they were to simply rename the 2 teams to some form of knights, it wouldn't solve anything. The problem isn't that the teams aren't knights, the problem is that the teams are just that. Teams. Within each team there's virtually no cohesion, and between the 2 teams there's no uniqueness. And no, one team being red and the other being blue does not make them unique or cohesive.

Those maps they're working on. If they follow the current trend of maps in mordhau, they won't improve anything.
And the modes they're probably working on, current rumors put them at just modified versions of frontline.
So modified versions of a mode we don't like, on maps that don't interest us.

Its an indie team. Nothing moves at light speed with indie teams. For fuck sake not even AAA games get large updates in 2 months lol

Apparently this was not conveyed strongly enough in the main post.

At this point, most people understand just how long it takes developers to make and update games. They may not have any context as to how hard or complex it is, but compared to years ago, people nowadays are much more understanding of the plight that game developers suffer.

This post was not a "UPDATE YOUR GAME REEEE GIB GUD CONTENT" thread. No.

This post was a clarification and condensification of the current issues of the overall experience that mordhau is supposed to be. And of the experience a large, large number of people, wanted it to be.

The gameplay of the game is good. We all agree on that. However, the quality of the gameplay doesn't matter when the overall experience is an uninteresting, uninspiring, and boring one.

777 1031
  • 11 Jun '19
 smellycathawk

@Dialectic said:
That chiv 2 trailer looked fucking awful. Tri can rename the mercs to 2 groups of knights in like 5 seconds if need be, and I guarantee they are working on modes and maps.

Its an indie team. Nothing moves at light speed with indie teams. For fuck sake not even AAA games get large updates in 2 months lol

I didn't think it looked awful at all

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  • 11 Jun '19
 SerAveryLongdick

Can relate. 170 hours in and only noticed Red and Blue had team names the other day.

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  • 11 Jun '19
 DylanS_98

Have to agree. The atmosphere of the trailer looked waaaaay better. But Mordhau's combat is just so fucking good.

I'll still play Chivalry 2 when it comes out. Just have to wait and see then.

Knight 1388 3163
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  • 10 Jun '19
 Tim_Fragmagnet

I'll make it simple.

Torn Banner didn't listen to their community asking for Chivalry 2, so they made Mirage. Now it's too late.

Triternion focused so hard on making the combat gameplay better than Chivalry, that they forgot to make maps or gamemodes we actually care about.

no.

Altering Frontline and using the same maps won't work.

Making Frontline go one way and calling it Push while STILL using the same maps, won't work.

These maps are uninspired, sterile, and boring.

These modes, uninteresting, and poorly thought out.


We know, game development is hard, and requires money, time, and effort.

Yes, your gameplay is good.

But the design of the maps, rushed.
The overall quality theme and design of the art, inconsistent
The atmosphere of the game, nonexistant.
The excitement of playing a gamemode you love for years to come, nowhere.

Team Objective IS Chivalry.
The fight between The Agathians and The Masons IS Chivalry.

What the fuck is Mordhau, because it sure as fuck isn't Frontline.
Nor is it these 2 groups of people we have no context of nor care for.


No, I do not believe that Chivalry 2 will have gameplay as good as Mordhau's, nor do I believe that it will ever see the lifespan the first did.

But look at that atmosphere in the 60 seconds we saw of it.
Yeah, shit animations, and probably combat that's just as bad.
But those 60 seconds looked far more visually exciting and interesting than my 600 hours of mordhau gameplay.

You could say that's because it's a cinematic trailer.
However the first Chivalry would argue otherwise.

Knight 1388 3163
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  • 11 Jun '19
 Tim_Fragmagnet

@smellycathawk said:
Can you rank the Chivalry maps now?

Simple enough

Same scale, this time also ordered within each tier for same tier ranking

Note, maps with kings are hard to rate, sometimes the king will sit in a corner for 20 hours and it feels like shit, other times only for a few minutes. Other times it will be a Chad king that actually goes into battle and fights.


S tier

Dark Forest - to the point where it's overplayed
Drunken Bazaar
Outpost
Castle Assault
Stoneshill - The throneroom is close to making this A tier.


A tier

Hillside - Would be S tier if it weren't for how brutal chokepoint at the beginning is, a lot of pubs struggle with it
Cove
Shore
Irilla


B tier

Battlegrounds - Quite enjoyed, the chokepoint at the end destroys the momentum of the map however. Suddenly turns into ramming your head against a brick wall for the remaining time.
Belmez - The beginning of this map is brutal for Agatha, but it's otherwise quite enjoyed. Would be A tier with some tweaks to the beginning.


C tier

Citadel - This would be S tier if it didn't crash people's game and didn't have balance issues. (You know the slaves I'm talking about)
Coldfront - This would be B tier if it weren't for the fact that the timer flips around when the masons break in
Hideout - Pretty map, shit design
King's Garden - Good luck killing me, I'm behind 30 chokepoints


The overall visual feel and design of all the Chivalry TO maps keeps them out of any lower tiers. They're all very pretty and interesting to see.

777 1031
  • 11 Jun '19
 smellycathawk

@Tim_Fragmagnet said:
S tier: best maps always amazing to see and play in, everyone enjoys them
A tier: preddy gud generally enjoyed by most people
B tier: it's alright
C tier: Not anyone's top picks but they'll play them
D tier: you don't want to play this map
E tier: people leave the server when this map comes up
F tier: if this map is picked, leave the server, close your game, come back tomorrow.


S tier

lmao


A tier

nope


B tier

Grad
Updated taiga


C tier

Camp
Mountainpeak


D tier

old taiga


E tier

nothing


F tier

Crossroads


Can you rank the Chivalry maps now?