Mordhau
 link_mah_boi
  • Likes received 67
  • Date joined 7 Jul
  • Last seen 4 Oct

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@ToLazy4Name said:
Nobody quit Warband because of female characters and no one is going to here. Anyone who unironically drops the game because of someone else's customization is a mong and probably won't be playing the game by the time female characters are added.

Warband is a great game, but you're comparing apples to oranges.

Warband had a woman warrior on the damn cover, so everyone knew what they were getting into. With its explicitly non-Earth fantasy setting of Calradia, and its frankly janky visuals and animations even for its day, nobody was expecting 'believable fights'. On top of all that, Warband realistically penalizes female characters' stats in singleplayer, too.

And I already own Warband. One of the main reasons I chose to spend $30 USD on Mordhau was its advertised "believability" being better than Warband's.

Insulting players doesn't build your argument, it's just being tonedeaf to a legitimate community complaint. And it's the exact same sort of behaviour I saw out of defenders of Battlefield V before its release. "Just don't buy the game if you don't like it!" We all know how that went.

Saying "good riddance" to quitters is not a good thing for a game with a concurrent population barely staying over 10,000 2 months after release. Retaining players is a good thing for Mordhau, and when there's an option that makes everyone happy and will retain players, it should be taken.

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Since release I really liked the way devs were handing Mordhau, no complaints, except maybe Crossroads blue spawn. I only found out after buying the game that female characters would be added (the Steam store page didn't ever mention it), but in the thread I found out, a mod said devs were going to give people the option to play Mordhau all-male (or all-female) clientside. That sounded sensible: people get to see what they want and everyone's happy.

Then recently, devs say: "the concept of a gender option toggle was dismissed as it would undermine the customization players work hard to create." This is terrible reasoning for dropping a good idea.

If all players have to be forced to always see your loadout exactly the way you want it, Triternion wouldn't have changed people's loadout colors to red/black and blue/white in Frontline. Obviously, customization can be undermined for the benefit of other players.

Let's say for example's sake 10% of the playerbase wanted the option to toggle off female skins/voices. In that situation:

  • A toggle lets a person dressed as Arya Stark get what they want, to be seen by 10,800 other players as a girl, and everyone is happy.

  • No toggle means 2,400 disappointed, irritated customers out of the total playerbase. And nobody benefits.

When female characters are added one day, and players open Mordhau to find a constant horde of loudly screeching 0/3/3 harpies added to their medieval game they can't turn off, I can say for a fact: some players are going to leave. Look at what happened to Battlefield V: Plenty of people just left.
Whether that will be a few or a lot who quit, I can't say. But it would be a dumb risk to take, for no good reason. A toggle is an honest, sensible course of action which gives all the paying customers what they want.

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@SWSeriousMike said:

@link_mah_boi said:
Another strawman from the sophist, are you just going to make up imaginary boogeyman arguments to knock over all day? Nobody said lawsuit, but it is grounds for a refund from Steam, and I don't want to do that.

No, it isn't.

Someone's not familiar with the ACCC, apparently. Valve is bound by consumer law on Steam purchases ever since 2015. It's grounds for a refund.

Thing is, I don't want to have to get a refund, I just want to be happy keeping the Mordhau experience the way I have it now, and keep everyone else happy also. There are no good reasons not to add a toggle, so add a toggle.

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@Deadmode said:

Battlefield V's death had has nothing to do with female or black characters.

You're pretty out of touch.

"The first Battlefield V trailer from last week's big reveal now has more than 320,000 "dislikes," which is far more than how many "likes" it has, and many viewers are expressing their opinions in some harsh ways in the video's comments section. It's a similar situation to the dislike campaign against Call of Duty's Infinite Warfare reveal two years earlier. Battlefield V has already seen its fair share of backlash before the trailer's debut. The marketing campaign for this installment focuses on female characters, even going so far as to feature a woman on the cover art. Some gamers were upset with this inclusion, threatening to abandon the series if the female players were included. A hashtag was inspired by the backlash entitled "#NotMyBattlefield." DICE general manager Oskar Gabrielson responded with a promise that the female characters would, under no circumstances, be removed from play."

Also, your arguments about the game being realistic are misplaced. You quoted the store page earlier, and it does state that it is a fictional but realistic world. That means that it is a world that is plausible, but entirely fictional. That means that you cannot have things like orcs and other fantasy elements, but female warriors, seeing as they existed IRL, are quite plausible in this fictitious world.

"Realistic" doesn't just mean "plausible", it means "the quality or fact of representing a person or thing in a way that is accurate and true to life."

Whether it's popular to admit it or not, we all know women are much physically weaker, slower, and more fragile than men, and this fact has lead them to be exceedingly rare sights on the front lines of battle throughout history, even to the modern day where fighting is just pulling a trigger. To really put into scope how uncommon it is, each 200 years, you might get one mention (often part myth- i.e. Gülnar Hatun) of a female fighter, across all the countries around the globe where millions of men were fighting on a frequent basis.

Even the most generous possible estimate would put male:female participation in medieval battles at a 1,000,000:1 ratio. Because, you know, they didn't want to die against much stronger opponents and nobody wanted to send them out to die.

So to see an entire group of skinny big-hipped waifus with tiny upper bodies and no visible muscle, optimized for sex appeal by their 13 year old players, churning their way through the battlefield? Not only is that less "plausible" than even Sauron armor, that is definitely not "true to life."

Lastly, to pretend that Mordhau isn't meant to be based on the real medieval Europe is disingenous; almost every single piece of gear is a copy of a real, historical object, the whole game is named after a German fighting technique and half of the game has real-world names like "Italian cuirass" for fuck's sake.They gave every indication possible that it is heavily Earth-based.

So you've failed to convince me that it's realistic, and you're definitely going to fail at convincing everyone else who has an issue with it. Which is why a toggle should happen, because it would please everyone and there's no good reason not to.

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@Antoniokontos said:

@link_mah_boi said:

@SWSeriousMike said:
There was no mention of people cosplaying as Hitler either. Where is the toggle for that?

If enough people want it then sure!

There's very clearly demand for a gender toggle, I don't see how not having other toggles is meant to preclude it

@ToLazy4Name said:
(vid)

Don't know if you noticed but that video was not on the Steam store page. Neither was there any mention of female characters in the Steam description, or the homepage of this website, or the FAQ. https://mordhau.com/ All you could see was in big words

"MULTIPLAYER MEDIEVAL MELEE GAME"

and pictures of dudes, and only dudes, fighting.

I knew nothing about this game having female characters until I'd already bought it. And after finding out, I was fine with it because a mod told me there would be a clientside toggle. Now there's no toggle, so I'm getting something added to the game I never wanted, and wouldn't have bought if it was made known to me at release.

And there are plenty of other people who feel the same way. There's also probably people who still haven't even heard about female characters and will only find out about it when they open the game one day.

https://mordhau.com/forum/topic/1008/development-blog-3-customization/

Ah yes, the 2 year old alpha video that wasn't on the Steam store page, wasn't on the FAQ, and wasn't on the front page.

Don't pretend it's reasonable to expect people to search through 2 year old alpha footage to find out a game is promising one thing and doing another.

What is reasonable, on the other hand, is adding an optional, clientside gender toggle.

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@Antoniokontos said:

@link_mah_boi said:

@Antoniokontos said:

@link_mah_boi said:

@SWSeriousMike said:
I fail to see how it would benefit me.

The playerbase not dropping off by an unknown quantity, meaning you have more people to play it with for years to come. It's only two months after release, and right now, there are only 5,000 people playing. It would be unwise to risk alienating players and dropping the playerbase even further, when you can just give people an option that keeps everyone happy.

this player base like chivalry is not casual friendly that's why the numbers are down its not the politics its the community those who remain will be the true fans the others where just on to see what the hype was all about

You're not getting my point. I'm not saying politics are why the playerbase is low. I'm saying, since the playerbase is low and this is a niche genre, adding controversial elements people can't disable will make the playerbase drop even further.

True players only care for being good in the game not petty settings

To me this sounds a lot like the attitude some Chiv players had with people quitting over ballerina spins. When you say "good riddance" to community members you disagree with and ignore their complaints, you end up with no community.

@SWSeriousMike said:
There are many people more I wouldn't miss. I don't think that racists, bigots and trolls are enriching my gaming experience. I'd even say alienating those would benefit me.

To say that everyone who wants a gender toggle is a "racist, bigot or troll" is disingenuous bullshit. As I have already said, people have given many reasons for wanting an optional toggle, including people who would like the option to play the game all-female, and players like me who don't even use text chat much- let alone to troll- and are totally fine with female characters in other, non-medieval settings but just can't get immersed in a medieval game where some thirteen year old's sexdoll is running at me screaming on every battlefield.

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@Deadmode said:

why are you getting so worked up about some women in the game but you are quite happy to face-off against a caveman, or a tomato, or Shrek?

"Caveman, tomato and Shrek" are not visible in Frontline because of team colors. You can't have the green white and brown for Shrek. All I'm seeing from my perspective is poor peasants wearing medieval clothing.

Your argument doesn't hold up with how Mordhau is full of ridiculously unrealistic mechanics, behaviour and content. There is literally no realism or immersion argument beyond the pseudo-realistic-but-still-very-arcade combat and some castles.

Nothing in Frontline is "ridiculously" unrealistic to the point of breaking any immersion you could have, which is why so many of us manage to have an immersive experience. There are small unrealistic elements here and there, many of which are unavoidable to make Mordhau work as a game, but none of them are constantly in your face and ears like a horde of screeching fapbait characters in every server would be. One guy in every third server standing in spawn playing a lute does not break my suspension of disbelief because I don't even have to see him most of the time, let alone fight him.

Medieval mercenary combat in the late 15th/early 16th century was a mishmash of different types of old and new gear, mail and robes and plate, helmets and hats, cavalry and infantry, spears and greatswords, with different mercenaries from all over the continent clashing in battle,, and that's just what Mordhau is. Overall, Mordhau is the second most realistic medieval video fighting game after Kingdom Come: Deliverance.

I hate this attitude of "oh well there are some small unrealistic things, so realism no longer matters at all and we can just add whatever to the game you bought". Especially when this game was sold with realism and believability as a major selling point.

Mordhau is FAR, FAR from that level of realism, which would support a strong case against their addition and there is literally nothing that can be presented to give a solid reason why, in this make-believe world, that women and black people can't be added.

I'm fine with expanded range of skin tones though, there's more historical precedent for it, and unlike waifu knights it's not ahistorical as well as biologically unrealistic and unbelievable.

And I'm not saying women "can't be added". I'm saying Triternion should give us the clientside gender toggle they brought up themselves as a solution to this issue.

@ToLazy4Name said:
Then get a refund and go away lmao they've given their statement

Dear Wannabe Moderator, nobody's forcing you to read this thread where paying customers, players who keep the product alive, give feedback to the devs. We want everyone to be happy and nobody to refund, which is an entirely possible outcome.

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@CocyxTheGaySkeleton said:
(strawman)

Imagine getting this mad about people choosing what they want to see in a product they paid money for.

I want this game to survive, as well, and there are people who will quit if this goes ahead. That's a fact, and you only have to look at Battlefield V to see evidence.

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@ΘЖ said:
STEAMCHARTS, the last 30 days have connected 28,000 players to mordhau. I do not know where you got the 10,000 players.

I said "just over 10,000 concurrent." Concurrent means at the same time. In other words, the 24-hour peak of Mordhau's playerbase. 30-day total is kind of irrelevant, because you can only play a game with the people who are on at the same time as you, in the same region.

in the middle ages there were women warriors, Nordic, Asian, Amazonian, etc... Adding female characters is not unrealistic

There were not nordic female warriors actually, that's meme-tier history, as a female professor of Viking studies can tell you. "Amazonians" are literally an ancient Greek myth. Finally, female Asian warriors (also uncommon) do not explain the existence of a female warrior in medieval European gear. There are 0 historical examples of group of women in armor physically fighting men on a medieval European battlefield.

Anyway, the main complaint is not even historical accuracy- it's the "believability" Mordhau was advertised for. You want to see what a woman fighting a man looks like? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRfCpQx_FDE The strongest of women are still physically weaker than the average man. That's why we have mens' and womens' sports categories, because even a drunk player ranked 203rd in men's tennis can beat the 20th best female tennis player in the world 6-1, and a team of boys can beat the national womens' football team 7-0. That's why we have lower physical requirements for women entering the police force. That's why dudes get asked to do hard things for women, lol.

It's not a popular fact to state, but it's true, many of us know it, and for a game that promises "believable fights", it makes it very hard to believe.

I recommend you leave the game

Like I said, that's a stupid thing to recommend to anyone if you want this game to keep having a playerbase in a year.

This whole argument isn't necessary when there's no good reason not to add the toggle.

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@SWSeriousMike said:
There was no mention of people cosplaying as Hitler either. Where is the toggle for that?

If enough people want it then sure!

There's very clearly demand for a gender toggle, I don't see how not having other toggles is meant to preclude it

@ToLazy4Name said:
(vid)

Don't know if you noticed but that video was not on the Steam store page. Neither was there any mention of female characters in the Steam description, or the homepage of this website, or the FAQ. https://mordhau.com/ All you could see was in big words

"MULTIPLAYER MEDIEVAL MELEE GAME"

and pictures of dudes, and only dudes, fighting.

I knew nothing about this game having female characters until I'd already bought it. And after finding out, I was fine with it because a mod told me there would be a clientside toggle. Now there's no toggle, so I'm getting something added to the game I never wanted, and wouldn't have bought if it was made known to me at release.

And there are plenty of other people who feel the same way. There's also probably people who still haven't even heard about female characters and will only find out about it when they open the game one day.

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@mr_jah said:
this is not a discrimination, am I not allowed to see what i want to see lol ?

Agreed 100%. After all, when we bought this game there was no mention on Steam of female characters ever being added.

There's no good reason not to let customers keep the visuals/sound of the game in the same state as it was at launch.

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@SWSeriousMike said:
I fail to see how it would benefit me.

The playerbase not dropping off by an unknown quantity, meaning you have more people to play it with for years to come. It's only two months after release, and right now, there are only 5,000 people playing. It would be unwise to risk alienating players and dropping the playerbase even further, when you can just give people an option that keeps everyone happy.

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@SWSeriousMike said:
The game was advertised with female player characters.
Also it's not like you lost a feature. Additional options are to be added.

Female characters are likely to be added and you are not entitled to a refund because of that. Deal with it!

No, the game was not advertised with female player characters. A video to alpha testers which was not displayed at the point of sale is not advertising, and it is not reasonable to expect a person purchasing the game on Steam in 2019 would go hunting for alpha footage from 2016 on Youtube.

If you buy a jacket and the cashier smears tomato sauce on it at point of sale, you may not have "lost any features" in that case either, but the look of the jacket is still ruined.

Yes, you are entitled to a refund under the consumer laws Valve are bound by if the product's advertising was misleading. Steam is actually very lenient with handing out refunds in my country now because of the court case where Valve got sued for $3 million for not giving refunds. I don't want to refund, but if no dev stance is forthcoming and the game becomes Waifu Simulator 2019, I won't have much trouble getting a refund.

Also, congrats for taking this discussion way off track.

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@SWSeriousMike said:
You need to sue them then.

Another strawman from the sophist, are you just going to make up imaginary boogeyman arguments to knock over all day? Nobody said lawsuit, but it is grounds for a refund from Steam, and I don't want to do that. I want to keep playing this game, with the current level of immersion I have now, and without other players also possibly quitting and dropping out of the playerbase.

Everyone wins from an opt-in toggle. People who want to play as a girl get to be seen by people. People who want to maintain their current level of immersion get to do so. And the developers don't lose a chunk of playerbase.

In response to your earlier comment:

1: Doesn't change what I said about it very rarely being seen in fights, 2, 8: See 1. 3: it doesn't happen "all the time"- that river is a small part of a single map. 4: Rocks are everywhere. AoE is the rock shattering on impact. The single person in the server using a catapult is looking at the battlefield, not the reload animation. 5: I just realized you're wrong anyway, there IS wind in the maps. Go look for yourself. 6: It's not "still unrealistic" because nobody ever has the room or reason to sprint "indefinitely", so they do not. Most sprints in the game are about 20 seconds long, there is absolutely nothing unrealistic about that. 7: No face visible, unmistakably female. 9, 10: How is "really" meant convince anyone? 11: You must have got mixed up, because if I'm meant to refer to 4, you're saying "horses are unrealistic because they reload automatically and have infinite ammo."

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So you respond to my point that those things were small and unnoticeable by... proceeding to list small, unnoticeable things.

1: Uncommonly will you see it, even more rarely will you see anyone actually kill with it. 2: Not visible or audible to anyone who didn't choose to have it in their loadout (I don't run Bloodlust), 3: oil burns on water and I have literally never even seen a firebomb touch water in Mordhau in 400 hours anyway, 4: "everything about" isn't an argument and 1 player out of 64 gets to use the catapult at a time, 5: have you heard of calm days? 6: already addressed, 7: actually most faces are quite normal, 8: see 2, 9: how is this unrealistic, 10: see 9, 11: see 4.

None of these, even combined, are comparable to having people's screeching waifu cosplays comprising 25% of the server in every server.

Just because you can't get an immersive experience out of Mordhau doesn't mean the rest of us can't. It is not a valid reason to say other people shouldn't be allowed a clientside toggle.

@CocyxTheGaySkeleton said:
how would u know whats realistic in the fictional world then. maybe theres a bunch of women warriors in that world. its fictional!

That exact argument you just made could also be used to argue for fantasy creatures in Mordhau.

"how would u know whats realistic in the fictional world then. maybe theres a bunch of unicorns and dragons in that world. its fictional!"

It's pretty obvious that what they mean by "fictional but realistic world" is "the things that happen in this game would happen in the real world too." That's how most people would interpret it.

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@ColonelMustache said:
In a game where you can beat a man wearing full plate mail to death with your bare hands in seconds, parry a maul with a dagger, cut a man's head clean off with one swing of a sickle, reload a catapult or ballista hands free in around five to ten seconds, place self-building spike walls and mini ballistas, and walk off being stabbed in the head by a polearm in seconds.

Whether or not you personally agree on its immersion, if you can preserve the immersion and believability other players had when they bought the game, why not do it? Do you really consider it a more sensible course of action to try and convince everyone that their suspension of disbelief is fine, and tell them to fuck off if they don't like it?

Everyone's suspension of disbelief is different, which is why some would be fine with Sauron armor and unicorns being added to Mordhau, and others would not.

To me, Mordhau's breaks with reality are uncommon or not obtrusive, so they don't break the overall immersion. Last time I died to fists in T3 was probably when I first started playing. I don't use a toolbox so autoconstructing spikes isn't an issue, neither do I use maul or dagger, and even if I did the occasion where the two would fight each other would not exactly happen often. The times I'm the one of 64 people in a server firing a catapult, I'm not looking at the mechanism, I'm looking at the battlefield ahead (and by the way I think touching up the cata animation would be a good idea too). Every polearm except Bardiche oneshots T0 heads, so no, you won't be walking away if you got hit in the head- and being hit in the helmet is not the same thing.

To compare this to a horde of people's waifus on every battlefield, constantly screaming, always present at all times to the eyes and ears is a clear false equivalency. It's much more noticeable by far than the sum total of anything you listed. And you're not going to fix that for all these players by saying "well the catapult animation is off too, lol."

In a game where you're just as likely to run into Captain Falcon, or Luigi, or Saitama as you are a historically plausible mercenary (who, even then, has incredibly anachronistic gear; kite shield and rapier, anyone?), find naked men playing Megalovania on a lute on the sidelines (who then proceed to use said lute to kill people), and have men with Oompa Loompa voices

Every cosplay just looks like red+black or blue+white medieval clothing in Frontline, no matter what cosplay it was originally trying to be. Maybe people have been dressing up as Captain Falcon in my games? I wouldn't even know. This build is not recognizable without the colors, so it has 0 effect on immersion.

As for outdated equipment: How do you think medieval equipment survived a thousand years to the current day to be sitting in museums? You think it just stopped existing? In the time period of the upper bound of Mordhau's equipment (late 15th/early 16th century), mercenaries WERE using a mishmash of polearms, chain, plate, frilled ruffs, bows, swords, polearms, and light clothing on European battlefields. Kite+rapier combo, again, isn't a common sight. Heater+rapier is, but that isn't too far from reality. Lutes, ah yes lutes, the thing I see in the hands of one person standing at the sidelines (as you said yourself) in maybe one in 3 Frontline games, that's definitely the same thing as a battlefield full of people's waifus as active, in-your-face combatants, in every game.

Players cannot be "naked" in Mordhau.

(Summary)

Everything in your summary is answered above.

I can't speak for the devs, but I won't miss those people if they leave.

I'm hearing echoes of the Battlefield V developers and defenders telling people "just leave" for wanting immersion in the setting. We all know how that turned out, and Mordhau does not have the massive fanbase the Battlefield series does to survive losing a big chunk of players in its first year.

It's not worth it. There's no good reason to deny people the toggle.

@SWSeriousMike said:
realism and immersion have already been refuted as arguments multiple times

Feel free to point us to this "refutation". And like I said: Even if you could convince me that my suspension of disbelief is just fine, good luck convincing everyone else.

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@Lincs said:
Not their stats.

Check again, because you're wrong. Picking a female character makes you -STR 1 and -CHA 1 relative to your ingame male counterpart in Warband. It also reduces your starting weapon proficiencies.

nor was there any such thing advertised in the original material.

Again you need to factcheck. Direct quote from the Steam store page: "Believable fights: A game where fights look believable". And also: "MORDHAU is a medieval first & third person multiplayer slasher. Enter a hectic battlefield as a mercenary in a fictional, but realistic world". You also have Jax saying in the video on that page: "you can fully immerse yourself in your medieval warrior", "inspired by historically accurate weapons from the medieval era," and "a historically accurate peasant weapon."

So you can't dispute that they promised the players immersion, realism, and believability.

It shouldn't even have to be explained that, even if you want to leave aside historical accuracy, it's not "believable" or "realistic" to see and hear 25% of the combatants on your battlefield as waifu cosplays. Whether or not it's popular to say, we all know men are a lot stronger, faster, and more resilient than women. This is why we don't have women frontline fighters even in most modern, progressive armies where all you have to do is pull a trigger, let alone fight in highly physical melee. Which makes it especially damaging to the immersion here.

What do you expect when we see these same arguments being made every single day despite being consistently refuted?

How bored you are of sitting on forums isn't relevant, the core argument of this thread has not been refuted by any poster:

Players who bought this game were promised believability, realism, and immersion, and we made the decision of whether it was believable for us or not based on what was shown on the game's store page. Female waifu warriors, which do damage many of our immersion, were not shown. There is no good reason not to add a toggle. Therefore, add a toggle and allow players to restore the realism they were promised.

Also, referring to Battlefield V is a false comparison.

It's a valid comparison because whether or not Mordhau named a specific year, it did still name a "believable, realistic, medieval" setting which is unmistakably European. Actually it's a generous comparison, because even DICE let buyers know on the cover of the game that it had female frontline fighters, making its claims of realism obviously untrue to the buyer.

but perhaps a compromise wasn't necessary. Look at the drama its hypothetical inclusion is already causing

Not from players. From PCGamer. And even PCGamer didn't make any "drama" over it, it just mentioned it. How many people did you see complaining that a toggle would be possible before that article? Plus, PCGamer's readerbase has already read the article. All the developers backpedaling on a toggle did for them was get an amendment to the article which nobody will ever go back to read anyway. Any damage that can possibly be done by PCGamer has already been done.

The drama being caused is over the toggle being deconfirmed. That's why many threads like this have existed. That's why many threads like it will continue to be made, like this one from 8 hours ago, especially when players who just play the game without paying attention to game journalists or dev statements open up their copy of the game one day to find screeching harpies in it that they can't turn off.

There is no good reason not to give players the option to see what they want to see, whether that be all-male, male/female, or all-female. As an example of another game doing something similar, Spelunky was criticized for having damsels in distress in the game, and so allowed players to pick whether they had female, male, or dog damsels in options settings.

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@Unlikely said:
Are you still fighting for the toggle that's never going to happen?

Is it so hard to actually read the original post of this thread, and see that this thread is a response to that?

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Impressive to see this done without officially supported tools.

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@CatR said:
(strawman)

I saw the literal exact same smug behaviour from Chiv players mocking people for not wanting ballerina swings in the game. I saw the exact same behaviour from defenders of Battlefield V before release. We all know how that turned out. You can be smug all you like, but you'll be being smug in a dead game.

Mordhau's playercount is at 4,629 right now just in the first 2 months, the game can't afford to add controversial things that might potentially make players leave, without any way to turn them off clientside.

@Deadmode said:
So you assumed that there was only dudes.

The advertisement for the game showed massive amounts of male fighters with not a single female knight among them, while the description called it "medieval", "believable", and "realistic". Because Disney princess warriors are actually not medieval/believable/realistic, no female characters is a completely reasonable assumption to make.

You might as well be saying, in defense of Sauron armor being added, "well, they didn't say it WOULDN'T be in!"

Personally, I think Triternion should stand their ground and stick to their design brief and what was promised to those Kickstarter backers and followers of the project from day dot.

Those few people who backed the game on the promise of being able to play a female character will be getting to do so. An opt-out clientside toggle means almost all players in a given server see you as a female character except those who specifically do not want to do so for reasons of immersion, not wanting to hit girls, etc.