Mordhau
 TheShade
  • Likes received 102
  • Date joined 22 Aug '17

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95 102
  • 15 Sep '18
 TheShade

@Naleaus said:
Maybe rewatch the first video and not cherry pick a single fight. Rick just backpedaled all the reverses and mostly got hit cause shit animation. Real fun to watch. Stouty did a whole bunch of dumb looking shit and got punished. Then check out the footwork that happens when Rick falls for a feint, or the early parries and then footwork to give time to catch the follow-up. The drags were the least interesting shit in that video.

To parry any reverse you sinpmy use footwork around your opponent. No one backpedals for reverses lol. I'm talking about footwork to read a feint, not to recover from falling from it. Objectively those fights were slowpaced. Slow for many casuals = boring.

What's interesting is the art of variating moves being used and not drags itself.

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  • 15 Sep '18
 TheShade

@Naleaus said:

@TheShade said:
It's fun and gives depth, you need skill to pull it off and you need skill to defend against it. A noob can pickup good feinting withing an hour and then make a 3k hour chiv vet start panicking.

This isn't Chiv, but let's carry on anyway.

No one can read Chivalry feints conistently since it has 15ms between a feints windup limit and release.

I don't play Chiv anymore, but pretty sure there's a 200ms cutoff on the feint window. Either way, it's not 15ms, so why make shit up?

Visually feints don't look that great for neither the defender or attacker.

Same with drags in Chivalry.

The defender just stands there without making any kind of "intense" movement. Feint reading is impressive for the competitive eye, but for noobs that don't really understand everything that's happening will find it looking boring.

If this is how you try to read feints, maybe that's the problem. How do you defend against a drag? By using footwork and pressing the parry or trying to punish. How do you defend against feints? By using footwork and not pressing parry and/or trying to punish. They're not that different.

It's fine if you like chiv drag meta, whatever. But give better reasoning.

Most feints are read by backpedling, staying passive and waiting for the end of the animation. Drags and reverses require more footwork to defend against.

Watch this fight between rick and stouty and you see how highlevel fights looks like and how dull and slowpaced it looks if you ignore the drags, reverses and accels. Watch the fights at 0:03 and 1:32. https://youtu.be/a4fnwirrp_M

Also this. https://youtu.be/cJVdV8gwQmA

What makes these fights somewhat interesting is the variation of moves that are being used. I'm for the removal of morph matching, but not at the cost of feints and morphs becoming too strong.

95 102
  • 14 Sep '18
 TheShade

Drags being hated in Chivalry is a pretty huge misconception. Just look at the steam community forums and reviews about it. Not many hates it and those that does just get attacked by the community for not understanding the mechanic. It's fun and gives depth, you need skill to pull it off and you need skill to defend against it. A noob can pickup good feinting withing an hour and then make a 3k hour chiv vet start panicking. No one can read Chivalry feints conistently since it has 15ms between a feints windup limit and release.

Visually feints don't look that great for neither the defender or attacker. If you feint you go back to your idle animation thensstart a new attack, which breaks the flow of combat. The defender just stands there without making any kind of "intense" movement. Feint reading is impressive for the competitive eye, but for noobs that don't really understand everything that's happening will find it looking boring. Imo feinting should not be the meta but an option.

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  • 12 Sep '18
 TheShade

@vanguard said:

@TheShade said:

@vanguard said:
We already had a drag heavy meta, and it played pretty shitty tbh, to the point I was having more fun with chivalry than with this game.

Drag meta is full of retarded manuevers that are shit to defend against tbh, the game feels inconsistent and exploity.

Feints are much more clear, you Know why u got hit. Drags can be one or 3 other different things that you/your opponent did that resulted in a hit, some of these things have no intuitive way to deal with.

Accels and delays are also clear. Waterfall, frisedrag, footdrags, these aren't clear.

I think it's really poor design to have things like this. Think on quake, it is a consistent game with consistent mechanics. Easy to understand what is going on.

I legit don't get why a drag meta would be so much better and skillful.

The problem with Chivalry was the exploits it had. Why would you go back to Chivalry if you are tired of drags in mordhau? Chivalry's drags are a lot worse to read lol.

Well no lol, with patch 16 drags were WAY more readable in chiv then in Mordhau tbh. Although they did look worse, the point is that you could read it.

Drag meta matters because it actually takes skill to use.

And so does feints, think when you were a noob, did feints made you win against veterans? No, feints probably fucked you up even more. I get fucked all the time trying to feint here in this game, which means it isn't "press buton to win".

Drags in patch 16 was a lot easier to parry than in 17. I guess you mean that drags were bad back then because they were a lot harder to chamber.

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  • 11 Sep '18
 TheShade

@vanguard said:
We already had a drag heavy meta, and it played pretty shitty tbh, to the point I was having more fun with chivalry than with this game.

Drag meta is full of retarded manuevers that are shit to defend against tbh, the game feels inconsistent and exploity.

Feints are much more clear, you Know why u got hit. Drags can be one or 3 other different things that you/your opponent did that resulted in a hit, some of these things have no intuitive way to deal with.

Accels and delays are also clear. Waterfall, frisedrag, footdrags, these aren't clear.

I think it's really poor design to have things like this. Think on quake, it is a consistent game with consistent mechanics. Easy to understand what is going on.

I legit don't get why a drag meta would be so much better and skillful.

The problem with Chivalry was the exploits it had. Why would you go back to Chivalry if you are tired of drags in mordhau? Chivalry's drags are a lot worse to read lol.

Drag meta matters because it actually takes skill to use.

95 102
  • 11 Sep '18
 TheShade

@PhillyCheesesteak said:

@TheShade said:

@GIRUGIRU said:
Feints are much healthier than swing manipulation as the main offensive tool in terms of visuals; it's easy to forget what the game looks like to outsiders and constant drag/accel spam does not look good in comparison to morphs + feints. This also makes things like riposte anims a less determining factor of what makes a weapon powerful

Mordhau has proper netcode and the existence of chambers, this means that feints can be balanced through mechanics and value tweaks - just because feints are very powerful dosen't mean the game becomes a 50/50. A player that can read will consistently beat a gambler

I strongly disagre with feints being healthier. Feinting in Chivalrys public servers was tabuu and strongly hated by the community, while any sort of swing manipulation was accepted (except for reverses). It was easy to see that outsiders from the competitive scene did not like the idea of there being an overpowred move like feints that barely took any skill at all to use. The game is being balanced around high skilled players right now and you are seemed as one of the best players currently, so ofcourse feints are not 50/50 for you but they will be for a lot of newcomers.

If feints are going to become as strong as they were in Chivalry the community will once again "ban" them from being used in public servers. It will become stale and boring to play since Mordhau does not focus that much on freedom/different ways to play. Feinting in Chivalry was so overpowered for the casual player that using it would be like cheating in a way so people just stopped feinting instead and came to a mutual understanding that feints did not fit in a place with pubbers. Just press a button and you win.

I'm going to guess you aren't in the alpha right now. Feints actually have a counter in this game - that you aren't a ridiculously accelerated attack.

I am but, but chambers are going to get heavily nerfed next patch.

95 102
  • 11 Sep '18
 TheShade

@Stouty said:
Dragging to get round a parry was always an unintended exploit, quotes from TB prove this. Feinting was the core game mechanic to get past parries and should remain so (not that drags are even underpowered right now)

TB didn't know themselves what was healty for the community. They don't really have a good track record for being good developers. It was obviously not feints that made the community grow, which apparently they wanted it to be. Just because the game creator says that "this" is the way to play does not mean it is any good.

95 102
  • 11 Sep '18
 TheShade

@GIRUGIRU said:
Feints are much healthier than swing manipulation as the main offensive tool in terms of visuals; it's easy to forget what the game looks like to outsiders and constant drag/accel spam does not look good in comparison to morphs + feints. This also makes things like riposte anims a less determining factor of what makes a weapon powerful

Mordhau has proper netcode and the existence of chambers, this means that feints can be balanced through mechanics and value tweaks - just because feints are very powerful dosen't mean the game becomes a 50/50. A player that can read will consistently beat a gambler

I strongly disagre with feints being healthier. Feinting in Chivalrys public servers was tabuu and strongly hated by the community, while any sort of swing manipulation was accepted (except for reverses). It was easy to see that outsiders from the competitive scene did not like the idea of there being an overpowred move like feints that barely took any skill at all to use. The game is being balanced around high skilled players right now and you are seemed as one of the best players currently, so ofcourse feints are not 50/50 for you but they will be for a lot of newcomers.

If feints are going to become as strong as they were in Chivalry the community will once again "ban" them from being used in public servers. It will become stale and boring to play since Mordhau does not focus that much on freedom/different ways to play. Feinting in Chivalry was so overpowered for the casual player that using it would be like cheating in a way so people just stopped feinting instead and came to a mutual understanding that feints did not fit in a place with pubbers. Just press a button and you win.

95 102
  • 31 Aug '18
 TheShade

@chaquator said:
jokes aside i agree with the parry turncap being too tight

+1

There is also a turncap limit after a failed parry for like 1-2 seconds which should not be there.

95 102
  • 16 May '18
 TheShade

All duels. Footwork in 1vx is the problem.

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  • 21 Apr '18
 TheShade

@Jax said:
chambering =/= reading

if he goes for a delay, you can just FTP out of it

Annyone can punish chamber attempts by hiding their manipulated swings, I really doubt you can chamber unpredictable attacks. Also, it's hard pulling of a correct ftp with the current fast swings since you would need to have pretty quick reactions for it. Even if you did pull off ftp it would just drain all your stamina until you lose anyways, since ftp drains a lot of stamina. Chambers are useless in 1v1 and specially 1vx.

Why didn't chambers get hit trades when ripostes got it? It sounds to me the devs rly don't care about chambers anymore and forgot to impliment hit trades on chambers or something.

95 102
  • 16 Feb '18
 TheShade

You should let NA play, high ping is only a disadvantage for them anyways.

95 102
  • 14 Feb '18
 TheShade

This is surprisingly easy and fun to read actually. I don't mind to keep it in.

95 102
  • 13 Feb '18
 TheShade

Its already released in the future

95 102
  • 29 Jan '18
 TheShade

The current animations makes it hard to know when release is coming, which makes accels harder to read, as well as drags if you are trying to chamber. New animations will hopefully be a game changer. I do think chambers in general are balanced atm though.

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  • 20 Dec '17
 TheShade

@TheKingInTheNorth said:
Is it me or do combos and chambers look and feel weird now? The game feels overall less responsive to me. Loving the new customisation items though.

I totally agree. Can not put my finger on exactly why, but I noticed it pretty quickly. Doesn't feel as "rewarding" and rsponsive to hit someone atleast for me as in patch 11. I really loved patch 11.

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  • 18 Dec '17
 TheShade

Parry, chamber and active parry all have broken hitboxes

https://youtu.be/yBWmnHoEm40 (Not my video, but the same thing happens to me and many others)

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  • 12 Dec '17
 TheShade

@das said:
Name 5 "current best players" in Mordhau, @TheShade. I'm curious what your perspective looks like.

Well, Idk how the NA scene looks like, but majority of the tier 1 players don't feel like relying on chambers that much (exception for a very few). I don't think the consistency of forcing clashes is a thing neither in EU.

95 102
  • 11 Dec '17
 TheShade

@Huggles said:

@TheShade said:
Currently the best players are those that don't rely very much on the new mechanics and mostly on their Chivalry experience alone. To balance things to be more like Chivalry could potentially damage and prevent the competitive scene to grow in the future since old Chiv players would start with a very high skill level. Currently we are only balancing things at very high levelplay and not considering equally as much the newcomers.

In Chivalry it was very hard parry on sound alone, considering the fact that the moment you grunted, the same moment you could get hit (If accel). On chambers though, you would hear if it's a chamber during its windup and the same goes for riposts, but instead right before its windup. It would be make it quite a lot easier to tell if it's a chamber or a riposte since you would have more time to hear and determine the differences.

umm, you're wrong. Almost everyone that is good fully utilizes morphs and chambers. Mechanics that never existed in chivalry. Plenty of good players are also pretty reliant and consistent on forcing clashes as well, another mechanic never present in chivalry. Mordhau currently has parrying that is significantly different than chivalry as well as major tone down drags.

A lot of chivalry "vets" relied on sow stab feints, spin spam trashing, and maa dodge spam. All these playstyles are dead and gone in mordhau. The people who are good at mordhau are the people who played chivalry the "right" way. Mordhau was always intended to be what chiv should have been, so of course chivalry veterans who hated all the bullshit in chivalry are the most hyped and the most ready to learn and train and therefore the best players. A lot of skill carried over from chivalry but the most optimal way to play mordhau is absolutely NOT the most optimal way to play chivalry. The opposite is even more true in a much more extreme way.

No

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  • 10 Dec '17
 TheShade

Just stab left if he stabs left to chamber, don't forget that stabs are also directional, no need to be able to morph to all directions. It would look weird animation wise if it was possible anyways.