Mordhau
 TheEmeraldArcher
Knight
  • Likes received 2560
  • Date joined 15 Feb '16
  • Last seen 12h
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Knight 1833 2560

I assume only gaymer can return

Knight 1833 2560

As much as I would love to form a meme group called The Merry Men and go around with 10-15 longbowmen and project cancer, I don't think that it's good for the base game.

I also think the archer limit shouldn't be like only 1 or 2 guys. I say it's no more than 20% of the enemy team, a maximum of 1 archer for every 5 men

Knight 1833 2560

@Sammy said:
I personally believe that crossbows should be forced to reload when pulling them out, since having a loaded crossbow on your back is borderline retarded.

At the very least, you can have your string cocked but have to quickly load the bolt when drawing it out.

I agree with what you're saying though.

Knight 1833 2560

@stael said:

@TheEmeraldArcher said:
RNG spread is quite literally the most frustrating thing possible for something that is not high in fire rate.

I haven't ever said that the spread should be random, I just don't want it to be visible in the HUD where your shot is going to go except at the optimal point. I suggested a spray pattern like CS:GO (because its the only game I know that has a pattern to its spray) where you know where the bow is going to sway, but it isn't visible in your HUD

Your character might visually see their arm and weapon sway more and more and the aim circle increase, but there isn't a visible point that moves around to guide you in interpreting the sway

I apologize, I misunderstood. What you're describing is literally what I am, it just has a big circle "shotgun" crosshairs until the sweet spot is reached.

That is actually not a bad idea. I thought you were suggesting full on rdm spread. We seem to have both been arguing for the same thing lol

I think one thing that might come of that is aiming without the crosshairs after the sway widens by judging where the bow is pointing, adding to the difference between good and bad archers. I really like this honestly. For the sake of sanity, you shouldn't be able to shoot until you reach full draw though.

Knight 1833 2560

RNG spread is quite literally the most frustrating thing possible for something that is not high in fire rate.

Missing because of a dice roll instead of your own mishap is quite irritating. All RNG will do stael is make good archers bad and bad archers get lucky shots sometimes. It is not a good solution plain and simple.

I never said the sway would be call of duty esque circle swaying that is easy to read and adjust, but I still think even that is better than RNG.

I really don't think that limiting someone to only being able to shoot unaware people would be a good solution at all. At that point it would be a lot easier and much more effective to simply run behind people with a maul.

I like the whole timing thing, but it must be something that can be worked around by the skill of the player or at a high level the weapons become straight useless. It would not be worth the investment at all, better off just to get some throwables and call it a day.

Knight 1833 2560

@vanguard said:

@TheEmeraldArcher said:
If that doesn't prove capitalism idk what will

Gotta see the bigger picture, your example proves nothing Mr Archer, doesn't reach any aspect of the whole critique of capitalism.

Well actually, it proves how cancerous this mode of production is, because it uses your intelligence and talents to make bombs to the biggest leach to ever exist in human history: the American ruling class.

They are using u to perpetuate this parasitic relation USA has to the whole world tbh.

The even bigger picture is I am using them to get rich and get knowledge to be used on nuclear warhead cancer arrows that can't be parried

Knight 1833 2560

@kEsa1996 said:

@GIRUGIRU said:

@moepork said:
main issue with archers in chivalry is that their base movespeed was too fast, so you could never close the gap without that dumb chase mechanic (which was incredibly inconsistent anyway)

also map design in general was poor to the point where there wasn't much cover to close distances / smoke areas off easier to make ranged combat less effective.

I agree, getting up to archers is one thing but then you also have to deal with their cancer running, so they can just continually prolong their miserable. Honestly some archers do a better job just wasting your time than actually shooting you

I don't see why archers need to have such a high base speed, they can have increased acceleration but faster movement is just unneccesary imo, will have to see how chase mechanic works in Mordhau

Hopefully there will be no chase mechanic. Luckily Mordhau doesn't have predefined classes and movement speed is determined by the gear you have on you, not what class you're using. Only thing I don't like about the system is that they are planning on preventing archers from using plate armor. Why? Limit the weapons rather. Say everyone has 3 slots of space on them for a weapon. Two handed weapons take up 2 slots, bows and crossbows take up 2 slots, sidearms take up 1 slot. This would prevent archers from being OP no matter what gear they are using. Also, assuming that encumbrance affects the speed of bows (It doesn't affect melee weapons), few people would want to use plate armor with bows as it would make the bow so slow.

Archers can't wear plate armor because to get plate armor you have to max out the defensive skill tree of that class, leaving you with no points to spend on the Ranged skill tree.

Tbh id rather have no armor with a decent melee weapon than be in plate armor with a dagger.

Be careful what you wish for

Knight 1833 2560

image.jpg

I went from being homeless to being a engineer making nukes and space rockets

If that doesn't prove capitalism idk what will

Knight 1833 2560

My idea has always been similar to this minus the RNG spread, and the devs have expressed similar ideas whenever I've spoken with them on the subject (though anything archery related is in dire need of work and not finished in the slightest)

You see, the ranged weapons will have sway effects, with the bow and crosshairs not remaining still. The longer the bow is held, the more it sways. When drawing back it also sways heavily due to your arm being strained. The optimal time to release is a short while after getting it back completely, where the bow will be nearly perfectly still, and then you gradually get more intense sway hampering your ability to shoot. Movement also causes the bow to jump around heavily. What this does is remove bs rng, and replace it with a mechanic that is similar but can be worked around with skill instead of praying to RNGesus. The arrow will always go where the bow is aiming, but the point of aim will be twitching around everywhere. A experienced archer might be able to deal with this vibration to bait a parry, adding a mind game to the practice of shooting cancer at people. People who know the timing of the sweet spot might instinctively parry at this time and get shot if the archer knows his stuff. That being said, the intense sway will make this practice extremely difficult at long range, forcing the archer to be within around 30yds to be effective against well aware targets.

This solves the issue of an archer being really far all the time. While he can pelt from long distance, doing so if they know where he is won't be very effective. This means he can get rushed more easily if he has not positioned himself well, potentially helping to remove some of the feeling of helplessness that a pure melee might feel.

The problem with copying the m&b system is that it would make the archery skill cieling very low and overall ineffective. Think about it, if you knew when the shot was going to come every time and if it wasn't shot during that time it would have random spread, then how in the hell would you not parry it? The archer would be giving away skill points for a weapon that cannot be dragged, is completely readable, and does nothing more than get one shot in on an unaware opponent, pissing him off , and then essentially waving a giant flag "saying hey I'm over here pls come end my suffering"

Not a very effective trade off imho, the ability to be unreadable is what makes using a dedicated ranged weapon preferable over full throwables (which don't take skill points last I heard)

Knight 1833 2560

@fiShbAllz said:
I'm not sure this is a thing already, but normal bows should drain stamina while it's drawn. The bigger the bow, the more stamina it consumes. Also it should become more accurate the longer you hold, until you reach maximum accuracy. This will atleast stop the spamming of projectiles, as they have to regain stamina between shots, or risk to become fatiqued.

I agree with this. This hampers the melee ability of the archer without gimping his skill cieling. If the archer is a better melee fighter than you he should still be winning that fight unless he stammed himself out. I dislike things that just make something bad out of the control of the player

This mechanic is indeed in the player's control though. If you've been shooting a lot and they reach you before you kill them, then you're going to get disarmed and ended quickly

Very fair mechanic imho

Knight 1833 2560

@FluffyDragon said:

@Jax said:
http://i.imgur.com/pZP3s59.jpg

This is what I'm talking about when discussing an item economy. A pattern-welded sword like this would be a perfect addition to the game in a paid-for skin version

I wanna make love to that sword

Don't forget to put some fur on it

Knight 1833 2560

@rattsknecht

Archers actually will be a bit better in melee compared to chiv to counteract the weaker archery. Marox has said this himself, so long as the alpha doesn't point out something really bad then it's all good. You can bring anything that still fits after the bow, which includes things like one handed axes and warhammers as long as this doesn't change during testing

Knight 1833 2560

Well I mean, if an archer is indeed good enough to do that kind of damage I don't see how it is a problem that needs to be solved. It's the same difference as someone who is infinitely better than everyone in melee, albeit more annoying. Gimping the guy just because he is good is inherently "anti-skill" as giru says.

Thing is, archery needs to be good at what it does so it is viable, but not as good as it was in chiv basically. Since there is always a way to defend a arrow/bolt regardless of your loadout, there is really no room to complain.

You see, you can do far more than just parry arrows. Let us not forget that chambers and ripostes have an active parry window during the beginning of their strikes that parries incoming damage. These can parry projectiles too, along with shields and normal parrying. Add in the fact that there is sway and you can see that archery is going to indeed be far more difficult than it was in chiv. I do believe though that if someone gets the best bow and spends all their class' skill points in doing so, they should be dealing some respectable damage considering getting in a hit will be tricky to begin with. It's going to take some skill I'd imagine given the mechanics the devs have talked about; and there is no room to complain about getting shot since, like a normal melee attack, it is completely defendable whilst the archer cannot drag or feint his arrow.

Knight 1833 2560

@Humble Staff said:
slings

As much as I love slings, they were quite a rare sight in medieval Europe. The sling just takes too much time to master compared to other ranged weapons of the time, and the cultural significance of it in Europe was null everywhere but the Balearic islands of Spain.

Staff / Pole slings on the other hand, while not exactly common, were seen enough for them to be recognized.

330px-Friezen_vallen_de_toren_van_Damiate_aan

330px-Liber3

War-Drummonds

I'd enjoy seeing these.

Knight 1833 2560

@ĶiĻăƦesrumpMcBøøgerballls said:

@TheEmeraldArcher said:
I also agree archers shouldn't exist in small comp modes like 5v5 and below. They have said a comp version of their big mode might end up being made. Considering the large maps and non linear path, archers should be in that if you ask me

Anything else I pretty much agree with you.

Massive Archer post coming soon. But if Archers were balanced and required more skill there should be no problem with archers in 5v5

Well the devs have already said that Archer weapons will have sway now, along with arrows and bolts being parryable like any other projectile. The main balancing factor for archery weapons is that they require skill point investment just like armor or anything else does (melee weapons do not take skill trees). This means that upgrading your bow choice to a better alternative requires you to give up armor or other skills.

Knight 1833 2560

@GIRUGIRU said:
LOOK at your name lmao. I asked a few NA players about you, they confirmed that to me that you are retarded and not a comp player, so no

with that being said, i also hope that archers wont be a thing in competitive Mordhau, they really offered nothing in terms of skill or depth into comp chiv - hopefully they are just a pub thing

I haven't played comp in forever, so it's not like that's an effective strategy. I can also find people who think you're retarded

I don't really see how random plebeian opinions should matter to anyone. You seemed to get a little too triggered friendo

I also agree archers shouldn't exist in small comp modes like 5v5 and below. They have said a comp version of their big mode might end up being made. Considering the large maps and non linear path, archers should be in that if you ask me

Anything else I pretty much agree with you.

Knight 1833 2560

@GIRUGIRU said:

@TheEmeraldArcher said:
Lol @ Giru

Much salt to be extracted from this one

i've come to fight back the autism, many "salty" chivalry comp boys will be rolling in soon to defend the territory from the freaks that lurk this sacred place

Posts own balls on twitch

calls others freaks

Assumes the guy never played in competitive

Tbh GIRU I don't think you have much to worry about, these guys seem to know what they're doing. You do realize they were comp players themselves yes? In the end they probably don't give a flying fahrvergnügen fuck what your opinion is though, they are making their own game. That being said, I still don't think you have anything to worry about.

Knight 1833 2560

Lol @ Giru

Much salt to be extracted from this one

Knight 1833 2560

@DerFurst said:
fatted.jpg

I'd name him Jiggelo

Knight 1833 2560