Mordhau
 Quenquentthebabysitter
  • Likes received 63
  • Date joined 5 Aug
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Just tested it myself in a controlled environment (asked for help in duel servers). Did it with a Buckler.

  • If you go down to below 0 stam (parry when low stam), you can still parry but lose the buckler
  • If you start at 0 stam (feint spam), you can still parry and lose the buckler

I have yet to see the bugged situation you are speaking about

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@SWSeriousMike said:

@Quenquentthebabysitter said:
I'm sure some people are. People that want new maps (not speaking of the two coming up), perfect balance and new content in less than 3 days. What I've said here is more targeted toward the people that wants everything now and doesn't bother giving some proper feedbacks.

There is no excuse for Crossroads being broken for 2 full months. There is no excuse for the out of bounds exploit in Grad taking months to be fixed. In 3 days I could fix that with no previous experience with the map editor.

That, I fully agree. Generally, you try to have one guy on one or two maps at best, just in case there's some balance fuck ups. But I doubt Triterion have the manpower to both update maps that got release and bound to have troubles while working on new maps. I wouldn't be surprised if Feitoria is delayed because the mapper had to balance Crossroad at the same time. I disagree that you can go from old Crossroad to new Crossroad in 3 days without experience (and even with some too).

Also special mention to Mountain Peak with all the parkour out of the battlefield and the lack of actual spawn rooms for non-final points.

@SWSeriousMike said:
The competitive scene only needs SDK support - nothing more.

And in the meantime, the casual scene needs content.

"They made more than enough money"
And screw the people that mix up money with better development times. The sad truth of programming overall is more resources isn't better timeline. Have you heard the joke "A project that requires 1 month for a developer to finish will take 3 months for 2" ? I understand that Triterion wants to stay as a small team, because the whole development cycle can get fucked if they get someone that doesn't have a similar vision to them.

That joke is working in the context of short development cycles. We are talking about multiple years here and the whole "hiring is too hard" argument falls apart. Open source projects manage to succeed despite people joining late.

Not a specialist so I can be extremely wrong, but not all open source projects are multiplayer video games. Some are non-profit too. The only game with a larger-scale team that only worked through Discord that I know of is Hunt Down the Freeman. And let's not talk about that...

But as I've said, I agree there's a lack of content, of balance and communication. People are angry, so am I, but not to the point of doing a crusade like some.

It's not really fair to call it a crusade when we are just posting feedback in the official forum. And bans are the only evidence that the feedback is read at all.

I might be naive, but I didn't see any bans regarding people giving feedback. I'm out of the loop here.

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@esturias said:

@Quenquentthebabysitter said:
Mordhau community : shit on the devs, insult Crush on a regular basis, and scream for Patchie.
Devs : become silent.
Mordhau community : "Why the devs aren't communicating ?"

That Mordhau had a lack of content at launch, I agree. That shit is unbalanced, I agree. That I don't see a lot of communication, even here in the forum, I can agree.

That this community is shitty far higher than their asses, wanting AAA+ quality of game from a small dev team in a cheap game ? Yes, yes they are.

"But muh money"
You spent 30 bucks ! That's it ! If you are a Kickstarter backer and you are angry what the devs promised isn't in the game yet, I agree, you are more of an investor than any other players here. But backers complaining are more the exception than the rule. Proof even in this thread : there's no Kickstarter backer here yet.

Three major mistakes there:

  1. Who the hell is expecting an AAA+ quality game? Show me one guy talking about anything even remotely close to that.
    What people are asking for is nothing but a working game with enough content.

I'm sure some people are. People that want new maps (not speaking of the two coming up), perfect balance and new content in less than 3 days. What I've said here is more targeted toward the people that wants everything now and doesn't bother giving some proper feedbacks.

But if we really want to compare Mordhau to an AAA game like, let's say, Star Wars Battlefront 2... Nevermind, let's not go there.

  1. "But the small indy dev team..."
    Yeah. Screw that. That argument is still beyond stupid. They made more than enough money to fix lots of the issues and to turn the game into something much better.

"They made more than enough money"
And screw the people that mix up money with better development times. The sad truth of programming overall is more resources isn't better timeline. Have you heard the joke "A project that requires 1 month for a developer to finish will take 3 months for 2" ? I understand that Triterion wants to stay as a small team, because the whole development cycle can get fucked if they get someone that doesn't have a similar vision to them.

Risk of Rain 2 made a lot of money too (more than 1 million copies sold), they are only 3 guys on it (yes, with a publisher behind them, but they are only here for quality control and port to other consoles), and the game gets an update (only moment with balance changes too) every 3 months. And you see people neither bringing the "Lot of money" nor the "Small indie dev team" cards, because they understand this kind of shit takes time.
Even if I have to agree, Feitoria (or whatever is the map's name) is taking quite some time to get optimized.

  1. "Just 30€…"
    Ok, fine. Just in case you need a new lawn mower, just PM me. Will only ask you for 50€. The basket is missing, a wheel is loose and the blades are dull, but for you that's still perfectly fine and worth every cent.

Thank you for telling me how's the lawn mower, I won't buy it.

Before buying Mordhau, I watched reviews and streamers playing it to see if I was going to enjoy it. And, considering I did not refund it before 2 hours of playtime, I think my money was well spent. I don't think many here thinks they got scammed or something tho.

But as I've said, I agree there's a lack of content, of balance and communication. People are angry, so am I, but not to the point of doing a crusade like some.

@Bodkin said:
Lot of text

You actually bring a good point. I've only joined since the release and didn't know how things went down during the kickstarters/alpha days. I am watching the whole thing from a reduced perspective. I remember in an other thread someone speaking about how held shield were much balanced before.

Yes, I am defending what I like, but I'm far from going full whiteknight on Triterion. Maybe I'm nicer because I was playing another game I loved that the devs forgot about and, here, they gives a minimum of a fuck.

@SWSeriousMike said:

@Quenquentthebabysitter said:
Really ? I though all backers had a special avatar frame and maybe a title. My bad then.

You are right. But I just chose not to display it. But honestly: Why should that even matter? That's the same dismissing criticism on Steam from private profiles. It's just an ad hominem fallacy that you should try to avoid.

It was more to point out how the "most hardcore fans" weren't caring that much, but you proved me wrong.

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@Bodkin said :
Bastard, Messer, Heavy Handaxe, Mace all have 13.

But you are right for the Mace. It's 13 here.

@Bodkin said :
If something costs 2 points, it should be a meaningful item for everything you can pair with it.

Either make Targe negation 14, and then Buckler 15 to compensate, or leave the stamina alone and give Targe a different niche, like a longer parry duration as I said earlier.

Don't quote me on that, but I think all parry shields have a longer parry window. I don't know of how much. And if it doesn't, then be smart with your loadout making and don't pair Targe with Messer/Bastard/Mace.

@Tr0gledyte said :
That explains a lot.. after some tests I noticed that, when I reach 0 stamina I actually become completely unable to parry at all! At first I thought I made mistakes with my timing, but that's not it. I don't lose the buckler, I just start taking hits. Is this normal? The parry button does nothing unless I put the buckler away. Then I can parry with my messer, but get disarmed immediately.

A buckler is still better at parrying than a messer but the lack of stamina gain upon being disarmed and the weird behavior when you reach 0 stam makes parry shields rather unattractive.

That sounds more like a bug. Myself I could still parry with a buckler but lose it when at 0 stamina. I guess I'm gonna test that as soon as I can.

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@SWSeriousMike said:
Nice one. Really pulled the "small indie dev team" card when they made millions at release.

And you really pulled the "I just want to say that you are a moron for no reason excepted that I want to" card. Those 4 points you spent in Dodge must have been worth it, seeing how well you avoided my point.

My point is it's a 30€ game. Even if there's a lack of content and balance issue, I've spent and did not regret spending those 30€. That they earned millions or thousands instead, what's the difference ? I'm sure people would have complained the same. Too bad we don't have the technology to travel between parallel universes.

But since you spoke about "small indie dev team", let me say a thing : this is the perfect moment for Triterion to hire more people if they want to. Right after a big patch, without the "Release's hell" schedule and some time to teach the code structure to newcomers .

@SWSeriousMike said:
By the way, I'm a backer so even that was wrong.

Really ? I though all backers had a special avatar frame and maybe a title. My bad then.

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@Bodkin
Targe is 13 negation rn but thats still equal to many 1h weapons.

Many being the Bastard Sword and Messer only.

@Tr0gledyte
despite the boost you get when losing the buckler.

Dude, read the patchnotes : you don't get a boost of stam from losing your parry shield anymore.

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Mordhau community : shit on the devs, insult Crush on a regular basis, and scream for Patchie.
Devs : become silent.
Mordhau community : "Why the devs aren't communicating ?"

That Mordhau had a lack of content at launch, I agree. That shit is unbalanced, I agree. That I don't see a lot of communication, even here in the forum, I can agree.

That this community is shitty far higher than their asses, wanting AAA+ quality of game from a small dev team in a cheap game ? Yes, yes they are.

"But muh money"
You spent 30 bucks ! That's it ! If you are a Kickstarter backer and you are angry what the devs promised isn't in the game yet, I agree, you are more of an investor than any other players here. But backers complaining are more the exception than the rule. Proof even in this thread : there's no Kickstarter backer here yet.

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Original : https://www.reddit.com/r/MordhauFashion/comments/cdkdcw/riot_police/

You can simply cosplay as one too

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@Sareth said :
I still think giving mounted players a chance to lose their weapon because it gets stuck in their target and ripped out of their hand as they ride on would go a long way.

Why people want to make horses weak as hell for some reason ? It's like having the catapult lose a wheel randomly and having to grab it back up for some reason.

@Goof said :
If you hit the horses in the legs it should instantly down the horse. I don't care what armor it has.

Hold on, let me poke his leg with a dagger to nullify all cavalry in the game.

@Goof said :
Race horses are put down for having an injured leg.

And swords can't realistically go through armor but here we are.

Players should really start to consider horses more like Tanks in Battlefield rather than something that should be as balanced as a player on foot. Yes, horses are annoying. Yes, they are tanky (and I agree, too tanky sometimes). But they are that way for a goddamn reason : they are fucking vehicles made to give an advantage to a player/team.

@Jur said :
Just make horses trip over beartraps also.

We had a small chat in one of JFJ's streams speaking about beartraps to counter horses.
The idea overall is good. Bear traps are only truly used to kill unaware opponents and block some paths. On top of that, due to the bear trap's hitbox, it's not THAT easy to hit horses with it. A challenging counter to horses that makes sense for only 2 points, even if it only dismount the user at best, is a pretty good deal imo.

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and make the main gamemodes less of the total mess it is its currently

The chaos of Frontline is what makes it enjoyable. Mordhau isn't, and shouldn't, be a game where everything need to be for ultra hardcore gamers because AAA video game X did it.

Keep Frontline casual for fuck sake

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@andres said:

  • Give each team a side for attack/defend and use stopwatch as tiebreaker (unless both sides defend successfully, in whcih case you have a legitimate tie condition).

Flashback from TF2's Meet Your Match update

No, Mordhau is not a competitive gamemode where we need to know who's the "true" winner everytime. As long as the maps aren't stupidly unbalanced and fun to play (cough old version of Crossroad cough Mountain Peak Red last cough), it's ok.

The big problem with Invasion right now is how 64 players are all clustered on a single and small objective.

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@bobbydigital said:
The maps just don't support 64 players all in one location at once, too many bottlenecks.

This is the main problem with Invasion, and why I prefer Camp to the rest. Most of the objectives are stuck to one and only one spot. The biggest exception are raiding objectives, Camp having both pushing the cart and destroying towers, and protecting the commanders sucking when one dies (generally the Warden).

I spoke about this in an other thread, but having more objectives at once, even optional ones (like placing ladders) would really help spreading players and make Invasion maps feel more like, well, an invasion

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Doesn't the Targe have a parry negation of 13 ? Can't check right now

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@Tr0gledyte said:
Pick a Greatsword and you can still get 2/3/1 or 3/3/0 armor which mostly makes your legs weaker, but the fun part is your legs can't be chopped off, so opponents going for leg hits will always leave your arms (and weapon) in tact when Flesh Wound activates.

So... Don't aim for the legs ?

But I have to agree that Mordhau have a small design problem regarding legs and leg hits. Not only you aren't penalized for losing a leg with FW, but overall legs are by far the least important thing to protect. Everyone says, whenever you want to gain some points for some reason, to sacrifice leg armor.

If leg protection was more important, FW would certainly be less stronger in a build with heavy armor.

Sure, you can't pick the more expensive weapons without serious sacrifices, but one can argue those aren't necessarily better dueling weapons anyway.

Mostly tend to depend on playstyle, but I agree with you here.

It's worse than Dodge

Another thing players can't agree on if it's overpowered or total trash. Not only that's 4 points, but the mere existence of CFTP makes this skill only good against weapons that can't combo (EX Sword, Maul...). Could go deeper on that but that's not the main subject here.

shields

Which got nerfed to the ground.

or even bandages.

I read your other post and there's one thing that I simply can't understand : why does taking a hit doesn't, at least, interrupt healing ? Ranged are already extremely punished by having you dropping them on hit. But bandages, something that can heal you 50 hp in mere seconds for 1 point, you have 0 penalties when hit ?

You also don't know if your opponent has the perk until it activates, it has a surprise effect the first time.

It's even complicated to see secondary weapons until he takes them out. But hey, if you know maths seeing the armor and weapons of your opponent, you can guess their skills too. You have to look for Dodge, FW, Second Wind and Tenacious (the only somewhat viable skills in duel. You could add Brawler but meh), which all have a different point cost. I'm sure it's something players will learn over time.

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@Tr0gledyte said:

@SoRoofless said:
I don’t duel so I don’t really know, but I’m guessing that if you kill your opponent while flesh wounding, you “win” the duel. But do you really win if you’re mortally wounded? I’d call it a draw, really.

It counts as a win, which is what makes it so stupid.

Well yes and no. They spent 3 points in it, why should it only helps getting a draw at best ?

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@Frise said :
A million good solutions were suggested during the 2 years of alpha and Crush is too inept to try any of them.

Devil's advocate :

  • A million good solution, where do you start ? So many ideas but so little time, where held shields might not be the priority.
  • What guarantees those are good solutions ? As far as we know, any solutions proposed here (including mine) can be absolutely awful.
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Why is thread still alive ?

@Mechanicus, you are trying to find a solution to a problem that doesn't exist. You are calling a goddamn game feature an exploit. You are losing your shit over something that only affects FL and Deathmatch.

Weapons already despawn fast as hell. As many said, you have to get the weapon on someone who just died or you killed yourself to grab their shit. I've lost my ranged weapon too many times after fighting off someone going melee on me due to this system. The fast weapon despawn IS the system to prevent skill-based loadouts to be above all while keeping them somewhat viable and fun.

People already spoke about how hard it is to adapt yourself from one weapon to the other in such a short time. It's in part what makes Mordhau good : all weapons feels and plays differently.

And let me give you the one proof that being able to grab weapons, making you go above 16 loadout points, is actual game design :

Scavenger

This skill is literally made around the idea of grabbing weapons from people you kill. Everyone can go above 16 points even without skills. All you need is a 3/3/3 guy with Greatsword to replace it with a Halberd. The reason you don't see everyone do that is because even lower point weapons have their upsides and downsides compared to higher cost weapons. Melee range and damage is still superior to speed overall, but that doesn't stop people from using the upsides of lower cost weapons.

The 16 points loadout system is here to grab what you want without having too much. To choose your starting upsides and downsides. To get what you prefer. If it's to get 3/3/3 Bloodlust and grab everything you find, fine, it's in the 16 points range.

Also, following your logic, tossed weapons like the Javelin shouldn't be grabbed without penalty. For me, the logic of punishing people above 16 points is wrong.

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He released it when you kicked. It's not that hard to read kicks as a shield user (as you get used to it REALLY fast) but it requires some used-to to counter it.

Also, when you stun a shield user, you have to attack rather fast. Don't drag or try fancy things, just overhead accel or stab.

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@Tr0gledyte said:
Sometimes it's not down to poor stamina management. If your opponent is constantly attacking you, giving you no room to regen, and his weapon has better stamina stats than yours, he can stomp you into being disarmed. You can't run away unless your opponent lets you.

Your opponent also consume stamina. If you get disarmed first, then either attack first or get a weapon with better stamina management.

Stamina is so important, it's one of the reasons using held shields isn't that great in duels and why many praise the Greatsword.

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I think people forgot this cost 3 points.

Let's assume you run 3/3/3, you have 7 points left for weaponry (Greatsword, Longsword + Arming, or whatever you like for 7 points). If you take Flesh Wound, you are reduced to 4 points (Bastard Sword, Mace, 2 Arming, etc...).

Now you could have less armor if you want FW + better weapons, but that's also less hits you can take depending on the armor removed + weapon you face. It's one more hit you can tank for one more hit you can't. Having FW cost 3 points, which is the same cost as +1 armor tier everywhere, seems fair to me.

Now I can understand people find Bastard/Mace/Arming annoying to face (or broken), and even more with FW on top of it, but it sounds like it's more of a weapon problem than a FW problem.

I mean, if you put your opponent in FW state, you can go full defensive for those last 5 seconds (I know it can be hard if you are low on stamina, but they spent point on that skill after all : it must be an advantage for them in some parts). You can also, and I know it's easier said than done, finish him off with a headshot.