Mordhau
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Knight
  • Likes received 136
  • Date joined 5 Jun '16
  • Last seen 30 May

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Knight 107 136

There would be a lot to tweak about this to make it a working game mode. But the idea is good. Actually, this is where Mordhau could really become a memorable game - offering a large amount of imaginative scenarios based on ideas like this. It adds a bit of immersion and role-playing into the otherwise combat-oriented game, which surely caters to a certain lot of players (while some could not care less).

Knight 107 136

@smellycathawk said:

Yeah the map design in Chiv allowed for fewer players to still feel like a massive battle.

Having 64 players adds nothing that 32 players doesn't have aside from poorer average performance, longer spawn times, and longer runs back to the objective.

I guess sometimes 64 players creates an interesting spectacle

My thoughts as well. In Chivalry, team objective maps were generally very well designed and advancing in objectives felt like an achievement. Maps felt action-packed despite half fewer players. In Mordhau as it is, environment feels mostly dull and unengaging and all focus is on fighting other players.

Knight 107 136

Valid points like 28 others. Keep making these threads until the problem is seen to.

Knight 107 136

@SushiFish said:
I have been thinking about this for a couple of days, but never really bothered to make a post about it. Since not everyone is here to have a productive discussion whether for or against the proposed idea.

If there were to be a such dual-wielding mechanic in Mordhau. I think it could function as being able to equip and decide which weapon to strike with depending on which side you are choosing to attack.

Right side > Main hand
Left side > Main hand

Or reverse for lefties.

This is actually not a bad idea to work with it either.

As for some of your follow-up questions... You should not allow throwables to be used in a free hand while a weapon is equipped. When you are using multiple throwing knives or axes, you tend to keep them in your free hand while the other is doing the throwing. However, while dual-wielding, you probably still should be able to throw on of your weapons. It could be worked so that you throw your main-hand weapon first, and switch off-hand weapon to main hand as the same motion.

A power attack, combining both weapons, also sounds tempting, but I don't know what would be the best way to implement it. Other weapons don't have that... so, despite the tempting visuals, it probably should be left off.

It's not very historical: meaning it has never been main-stream in history. Parrying daggers have been frequently used alongside with longer blades, but fighting with two weapons of equal length has always been a curiosity at best. Still, it's been done. Maybe have it locked behind an ambidextrous perk that forces you to pay some extra points for it.

Knight 107 136

@Pharmacist said:
Ballerina-ing and blendering is still a thing - which is not very fun to fight against.

And it's sooo funny to hear people tell you it's no longer a thing.

Knight 107 136

@Bellon said:
Only thing I'm not sure about: Letting you use a pavise shield as an even better normal shield may result in some even cheesier tactics.

Naturally if pavise was reworked as suggested, it should be raised to 3 points in cost. Other way would be to model an entirely new shield (tower shield?) based on pavise shield's size and holding animations.

Knight 107 136

I concluded in a couple other threads that the easiest way to allow a historically sound method of "dual-wielding" would be to offer parrying dagger reskin for buckler. You know, after first properly fixing buckler so that you can hit with it using the kick button.

This way the offhand weapon is used defensively, but can also be used to attack on occasion at short reach.

Wielding two weapons of same length is not very historical (or practical for the matter). I don't think that should be implemented.

Knight 107 136

Then again, it is incredibly easy to get past the spear tip and run to a close range as well. If spears should not be able to stab at short range, then moving in should be made harder. Also, same logic should apply to zweihanders, halberds and most long weapons. They all require quite a bit of distance for optimal use.

Spears are very easy weapons by their nature. That's why they armed peasantry with spears in literally every country. Spears are cheap to make and it's relatively easy to train people to use them effectively, as opposed to most weaponry.

Knight 107 136

@Christian2222 said:
Maybe weapons like bill hooks, and axes can grab shields, and pull them. Or have a move so you can grab a shield..... but that might require an added grappling type system.

Grappling-like system would be somewhat easy to implement. Consider this:

  • If you are unarmed and kick the opponent successfully from a hugging range, you enter into a grapple. It's a (2-3 second) click-war with the opponent to generate power. Whoever wins, throws the opponent to the ground, ragdolling him like a kicked door would.

  • If you successfully kick a raised shield when holding a billhook, you lock the billhook to the shield's edge instead and start a grapple. If you win the click-war, you disarm the opponent's shield. If the opponent wins, he wrenches the shield free.

  • If someone else hits one of the grapplers, the grapple breaks.

  • Grappling would be avoidable by moving and not allowing the opponent to facehug.

  • Some other weapons and conditions could initiate a grapple as well.

Knight 107 136

@Bellon said:
It would also set a nice precedent for other offhand weapons (parrying dagger?) and give the buckler/targe a better niche.

I think the developers were pretty much set on not having dual-wielding (two melee weapons). But as a reskin of buckler, the parrying dagger just might work.

Knight 107 136

@Deadmode said:
Skilled archers do very well and you can often see/feel their impact in a game if they are playing good counter-archer strategies.

This is a problem. Archers are FORCED to play counter-archer, if they want to do well. In a well-rounded game, archers would be able to target melee guys, and still do well. This would be possible by adding a perk like Huntsman that would increase damage on heavy armor (Bodkin).

Knight 107 136

It's pretty much a long-bladed spear. In fact, Champion's Spear skin looks just like it.

Knight 107 136

@TrustyWays said:
Shields still work well and I think it still is too op, top guy in duel yards are still shieldeddudes and kicks are still a joke.

If you rage over a balance, well, that's quite sad. You can easily be on the top of the scoreboard with it.

I hope you remember the shield and LS nerf on chivalry, it was worst.

I assume you are purposefully trolling. Shield is garbage atm. Good players can get medium-level scores with it.

Who are the "top guys" in duel yards that main shield? Never seen them.

Knight 107 136

Yeah, totally makes sense. Weapons that actually SHOULD slow you down (like huge swords, battleaxes, maul) don't slow you one bit, but bows do. Makes a looooooooooooot of sense.

Knight 107 136

Yeah, wearing a shield over the back probably should give some damage reduction. It's silly how melee attacks just go through it like it was air. But like you say, the reduction shouldn't be too much, to discourage everyone from going shield-turtle, like in Chivalry. Definitely giving thumbs up for a small added damage reduction.

Knight 107 136

Examples of historical aggressive shield use can be found from some European fighting manuals. Talhoffer -- from which the word Mordhau itself originates -- presents many illustrations where a large shield is used two-handed to attack an opponent. Maybe ideas for fighting with pavise shield.

Knight 107 136

@Lit_red said:
Why spend 3 points on a tool that barely helps you when you can just replace your shitty onehanded weapon with something more impressive? The buckler only slightly reduces stamina loss, but if you decide to upgrade your arming sword to a longsword you get the same thing, PLUS doubled slash damage and range, increased drag potential, increased stamina drain and even the ability to throw pommels, which is the strongest weapon there is.

That's exactly why buckler -- as it currently is -- is way overpriced. It should be reduced to 1-2 points, or functions should be added to it.

Knight 107 136

Yeah, I actually suggested this earlier for buckler. So, completely agreeing. Buckler should ease chambers and/or reduce their cost (or ripostes), and a parrying dagger definitely should be added as a buckler skin.

This is actually a very easy to implement a sort of "dual-wielding" that was a thing many players requested at the early alpha. Just reskinning buckler for a defensive secondary weapon.

Knight 107 136

Sounds very dynamic. Might work very well.

Knight 107 136

Shields are still missing some integral functions (besides being nerfed towards a meme weapon):

  • Kick disabled when you hold only a shield:
    There is absolutely no reason for a fighter to be unable to kick, if he is not holding a melee weapon besides a shield. You might have thrown your one-handed weapon, and suddenly you cannot kick before you drop the shield or equip another one-hander. Ridiculous. Kicking should be made possible when holding only a shield.
  • Free hand punching disabled when you hold only a shield:
    Same as above. Suddenly, after you've thrown your weapon, your free hand becomes paralyzed and you cannot use it to punch, before the shield is removed. Punching with free hand should be an option when holding only a shield.
  • Pavise shield cannot block:
    Pavise shield is held in a two-handed grip in front of the character when equipped. Despite of this, it cannot be used to block melee attacks. It should. Considering it is a huge shield and two hands are used to hold it, the stamina drain should be the among the lowest and parry box the largest.
  • No shield push/slam:
    This is a major failing. Anyone who knows anything about fighting with shields knows that it is not a passive protective tool. Pushing or hitting with the shield is an integral part of it, and should be enabled in the game somehow. This could replace kicking when a shield is equipped. Larger shields should produce more knockback, while smaller shields should produce more damage.