Mordhau

My opinion on reintroduction of hit-stop

2 0
  • 1 Apr
 Dane
 Hi, been playing Mordhau for a good bit now. Level 135 currently. I wanted to talk about the hit-stop, I understand there are many people who hated when it was removed and probably love it now, but, it just isn't serving its intended purpose, among other things. Friendlies still swing and hit you, and because their swings are not also hitting the enemy, it takes more swings for them to stop, if that makes sense, haha. 

 Secondly I am really against hit-stop because it is only one sided. I don't like the fact that we receive "individual" disadvantages when fighting in a Many-V-1 scenario, if the enemy player can swing through, so should you. The riposte mechanic is plenty enough for a seasoned mordhau veteran to stomp multiple enemies at once. I am level 135 after all and there are still plenty of new players, so I say that totally objectively (I was able to kill multiple players at once before hit-stop was re-added.) Mordhau has some very awesome mechanics with drag/accel of your weapon and for that reason I am a "pro-swing" kind of player. I enjoy swinging rather than stabbing and this latest patch has significantly nerfed swinging. There are twice as many spear and other stab weapon wielding enemies now, which is fine, but I don't think swing attacks should be this much less effective, if at all, and they totally are now. For example, without the introduction of hit-stop, the nerf to the Zweihander would help put it in a fairly balanced state but because of hit-stop, it's nerf is to much, for example. Its so hard to get a swing in on objective maps and enclosed areas with larger weapons to begin with and now you have to rely even more on stabbing which is just simply much less effective with the Zweihander than it is with the spear or billhook. Also, for all the people who love to talk about realism, its not realistic to swing through an enemy but not a friendly (just feel like I need to include that for those people who really enjoy more realistic gameplay.) 

 There are so many different little issues I have that hit-stop puts into gameplay I don't think I could remember them all at once, but one that comes to mind is from the perspective of the "one" in a one-versus-many. Without hitstop when players swing, you know those attacks are going to make it to you and you can parry when needed. With hitstop there is so much RNG and generally makes those situations even more complicated. Personally, as a high level player, I actually think this makes it harder for me to fight many enemies at once. I constantly end up parrying an incoming attack from an enemy player, which then lands on his teammate with poor awareness and  I am stuck there with a parry lockout and no riposte. This happens SO MUCH to me, its crazy. They're like tactical misses (you know when the enemy misses you and you parry because you didn't think he was that bad, and then you get killed by the other dude xD) I think the game was in a really good state before this patch, and truthfully I would love if the hit-stop mechanic was removed, again. 

Anyway, that is all, thank you for reading.

1697 1291
  • 1 Apr
 esturias

@Dane said:
Secondly I am really against hit-stop because it is only one sided. I don't like the fact that we receive "individual" disadvantages when fighting in a Many-V-1 scenario, if the enemy player can swing through, so should you.

That doesn't make much sense. The single guy swings through only enemies.
And if you are such a seasoned and experienced player, shouldn't it be rather easy to get along with the hitstop?

2 0
 Dane

@esturias said:

@Dane said:
Secondly I am really against hit-stop because it is only one sided. I don't like the fact that we receive "individual" disadvantages when fighting in a Many-V-1 scenario, if the enemy player can swing through, so should you.

That doesn't make much sense. The single guy swings through only enemies.
And if you are such a seasoned and experienced player, shouldn't it be rather easy to get along with the hitstop?
What I meant is the single player is given a significant advantage with this mechanic, but, I don't feel like there should be any advantages along with the riposte unflinching swings that already exist. Youre SUPPOSED to be pretty screwed in a 1vMany. I think it should be completely skill based. I dont like when they add in handicaps because youre out of position.

Of course I can get by without it. I still enjoy playing Mordhau, I just think the game was MORE enjoyable without the mechanic. Keep in mind as a player who loves using halberd, zweihander, etc., its a lot different for me than it is for players who enjoy rapier, spear, and such. Anyways, all just a matter of opinion, but wanted to share my two cents.

199 263
  • 3 Apr
 Quenquent

@Dane said:
Friendlies still swing and hit you, and because their swings are not also hitting the enemy, it takes more swings for them to stop, if that makes sense, haha.

Holy crap, it's as if teamfighting was an actual skill to have instead of swinging-in blindly.

Not having hitstop because your teammates are idiots is not a good reason to remove it. The skill celling of the game shouldn't be reduced because your teammates are doing mistakes. An idiot-proof system only makes better idiots.

@Dane said:
Secondly I am really against hit-stop because it is only one sided. I don't like the fact that we receive "individual" disadvantages when fighting in a Many-V-1 scenario, if the enemy player can swing through, so should you.

Yes, you can also swing through enemies, isn't that fair game ? And they cannot swing through their allies. It's as if hitting teammates is supposed to be a mistake you should be punished for...

@Dane said:
I enjoy swinging rather than stabbing and this latest patch has significantly nerfed swinging. There are twice as many spear and other stab weapon wielding enemies now, which is fine, but I don't think swing attacks should be this much less effective, if at all, and they totally are now.

You know you can swing with overheads and underhands ? They take way less space than your normal horizontal attacks.

@Dane said:
For example, without the introduction of hit-stop, the nerf to the Zweihander would help put it in a fairly balanced state but because of hit-stop, it's nerf is to much, for example. Its so hard to get a swing in on objective maps and enclosed areas with larger weapons to begin with and now you have to rely even more on stabbing which is just simply much less effective with the Zweihander than it is with the spear or billhook.

I also think you see less of these weapons since you can't swing to win in teamfights anymore. People in video games tend to over-exaggerate nerfs in video games. They will come back soon.

@Dane said:
Also, for all the people who love to talk about realism, its not realistic to swing through an enemy but not a friendly (just feel like I need to include that for those people who really enjoy more realistic gameplay.)

I'm sorry, but it's not too realistic to swing through 5 plate-armored people in the first place. Realism to force "balance" is a bad argument.

@Dane said:
Without hitstop when players swing, you know those attacks are going to make it to you and you can parry when needed.

That is, if you can see the attack coming from behind another enemy. It wasn't unusual to see people grab long-ranged swing weapons with Friendly and hide their swings behind teammates, using them as human-shield at the same time. There was no reason to not use Zwei/Executioner when hitstop was removed.

@Dane said:
With hitstop there is so much RNG and generally makes those situations even more complicated. Personally, as a high level player, I actually think this makes it harder for me to fight many enemies at once. I constantly end up parrying an incoming attack from an enemy player, which then lands on his teammate with poor awareness and I am stuck there with a parry lockout and no riposte. This happens SO MUCH to me, its crazy. They're like tactical misses

The devs are working on something against "tactical misses", to reduce the parry recovery time when it happens or something similar.

I also suggested before to allow riposte to swing-through, as they are predictable and when a riposte happens, you always expect it to come hit you. Jax liked the idea, but I guess the rest of the dev team didn't agree/didn't have time to implement it.

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  • 15 Apr
 thecamguy

I don't like hit stop either, but I don't agree with all of what you say. I saw Boboknight11 suggest on another post that swinging through a team mate should cause your strike to instead land a glancing blow. This would fix getting stuck in parry recovery because the enemy is hitting each other, and also nerf idiots who blatantly swing through their team for kills.