Mordhau

Feitoria balancing

16 18
  • 31 Oct
 bOMBADlL

Well I've played lots of game on Feitora and here are my suggestions. The big problem with the map is that red wins too easily, which might be due to Blue not yet knowing how to properly defend, and that the objectives are too easy for the attackers.

First part is fine imo, although you're pushing a giant tower upward for 5 minutes, yet everyone prefers using ladders because the climb is 2mn long. This might be dumb but maybe the devs should add some sort of straight ramp or at least a ladder to make the tower more important? It just seems weird that the first objective is discarded by the players so quickly. Why even bother pushing it when the city is already so full of passages? This is a general observation, getting in Castles and other fortified places is always too easy, it should be a battle to get it, yet Grad has multiple tunnels and many holes. In that note, Grad should have a second objective in Invasion, which should be to blow up the castle's wall near the Forge.

Second part is always ruined either by Hapsburg-tier nobles who rush the enemy thinking their great size grants them invincibility, or the nobles get ganked by reds who wait for them to spawn.
Can't do much about player's IQ but the spawn thing could be solved by making them spawn behind the line or with a "guard" (5 or 6 players spawn in the same room at exactly the same time).

The third part is the worst part. Any game I've won in Blue were due to Nobles successfully hiding their shit, but I do not think I've ever seen the defenders win at that point. The objective plays too quickly, which is a shame because I would like to enjoy the unique urban fighting but it is always over in 2 minutes. Once you've memorized the route to the peasants you can get them too easily, people choose a fast assassin loadout where they just parkour their way up to them or spam firepots for the rare ones who are guarded by players (firepots which imo ruins a bit of the game and should have their distance nerfed and cost more points). The civilians themselves are not really protected all that well by the defenders either.
My solution would be to either buff Civilian's health, make them spawn in more secluded places, give them more health, or make some of them controlled by players. Also maybe add a general "burn X" objective like it was done on Grad Frontline Mode to lengthen the mode.

Finally, I think that the "Objective lost, retreat!" mechanic is bad, much more time should be given to the defenders to get back, during which time the attackers would be unable to go further, which would prevent Reds from getting too far into the map and help Blues organize the defenses.

Once again, the objectives are one of the game's big drawbacks, they are not really compelling, and more often than not unbalanced as shit. Chivalry was much better in that regard, and I hope the devs will really put some thoughts into making it's main game modes more fun and memorable. They should also pay very close attention on how some players will cheese the shit out of them, and about how most of the defenders won't really pay attention to what is going on plan accordingly.

I hope that my topic wasn't too badly worded, thank you for reading!

16 18
  • 31 Oct
 bOMBADlL

pls respond

Knight 240 1078
  • 31 Oct
 Corsario

Well thought out feedback. Designing objectives is hard, sometimes, and needs a lot of feedback to make them play out as they should.

860 644
  • 1
  • 31 Oct
 esturias

@bOMBADlL said:
pls respond

You started your thread ONE HOUR ago on a dead forum. This isn't a chat.

Well I've played lots of game on Feitora and here are my suggestions. The big problem with the map is that red wins too easily, which might be due to Blue not yet knowing how to properly defend, and that the objectives are too easy for the attackers.

That's a general problem of the Invasion gamemode. The only way for Blue to win is to use the most boring and low tactic available: Locking their nobles in the tower in the back. Like the only way for Blue to win on Grad is hiding the noble, too. Except, of course, the Red team sucks massively and doesn't care about the objective, which happens often enough...

Blue can't win because they have to blink just once to lose a point and you can't make the objectives much harder because Red can't keep up the pressure. The whole concept of the gamemode isn't very thought out. It doesn't fit together very well. Especially not with the game's general balance and all the other problems.

16 18
  • 2
  • 31 Oct
 bOMBADlL

@esturias said:

@bOMBADlL said:
Blue can't win because they have to blink just once to lose a point and you can't make the objectives much harder because Red can't keep up the pressure. The whole concept of the gamemode isn't very thought out. It doesn't fit together very well. Especially not with the game's general balance and all the other problems.

But what was different with Chivalry? I remember the objective mode games lasting much longer and being more balanced

1369 3921

@bOMBADlL said:

@esturias said:

@bOMBADlL said:
Blue can't win because they have to blink just once to lose a point and you can't make the objectives much harder because Red can't keep up the pressure. The whole concept of the gamemode isn't very thought out. It doesn't fit together very well. Especially not with the game's general balance and all the other problems.

But what was different with Chivalry? I remember the objective mode games lasting much longer and being more balanced

mordhau is much faster paced the health regen being the best example maps had +10mins for an objective capture rather than our +5 and lets not forget trying to push the dark forest cart at the 2nd obj

Knight 218 593

Totally agree, the siege tower feels completely useless, it's way easier to just run inside the tunnels and come behind the enemies than it is climbing the ladders (although climbing ladders is also quite easy if you have a 1h weapon). Make it so defending team can kick the ladders while people are climbing them but make the climbing time a bit shorter so defenders actually have to keep an eye out. Moving speed while carrying rocks could be increased slightly to aid defenders. How about adding some of the newly added boiling oil? You know, the one you just advertised triternion, how about adding that to the actual siege map?

Also, don't fucking hinder you from attacking from the other side; you can travel around the castle on the outside but if you try to climb the tower from the other side you're outside of the play area, which imo breaks immersion quite a bit.

Also maybe add a general "burn X" objective like it was done on Grad Frontline Mode to lengthen the mode.

What about that huge farm area on the other side of the castle, which is completely unsued. It looks to be quite fleshed out, so it could be used for a seconod objective. Also, we could kill some more peasants there because that's fun.

Finally, for more balance, just add more citizens to kill, make them run faster, make them not spawn in the same places every single map (seriously why did you not think of this9. And don't give them an icon display so that red team can just hone in on them easy. Maybe create a final objective by the docs? Something that the red team has to transport a flag over there? Something to draw out the final fight a bit more.

Knight 218 593

Also, just make more of towers climbable, all the "large" windows able to enter (because many windows look like they're big enough and you can't squeeze through) and just reward defenders who are actually doing the objective. Give defenders extra points for staying on the siege tower when the enemy pushes, give them points for defending up on the wall, points for staying near the civillians and so on. Just encourage players to play the objective. Imo it's why some players play attacking, because there's more points to harvest.

16 18
  • 2 Nov
 bOMBADlL

@Mr_Obliviousness said:
Also, just make more of towers climbable, all the "large" windows able to enter (because many windows look like they're big enough and you can't squeeze through) and just reward defenders who are actually doing the objective. Give defenders extra points for staying on the siege tower when the enemy pushes, give them points for defending up on the wall, points for staying near the civillians and so on. Just encourage players to play the objective. Imo it's why some players play attacking, because there's more points to harvest.

I think that the Nobles should be chosen among those who held the objective the longest, and not based on how much killed you've raked on a horse
For one it would encourage people to play the actual objectives and prevent braindead nobles from spawning

Sellsword 720 2234
  • 5 Nov
 Goof

There's WAY too many entrances into the castle as is.

The entrances to the lower level at least should be busted open by either catapult or explosive barrels.
The map is simply too hard to defend for blue due to the large amounts of entrances available.

The only feasible way to properly defend right now would be posting a few people at each entrance. But to be honest, nobody is going to do that.

The tunnel is too easy to get through, takes probably a minute tops, much less with more people carrying pickaxes.

It seems like devs have taken the feedback on bottlenecking way too far on this map. It's good to have multiple entrances but this is ridiculous.

860 644
  • 5 Nov
 esturias

@Goof said:
It seems like devs have taken the feedback on bottlenecking way too far on this map. It's good to have multiple entrances but this is ridiculous.

Huh? Where exactly did they take any feedback?
The Feitoria castle is exactly like the Grad castle - high walls but riddled with entrances on every side, making them completely useless. Bonuspoints for the critical spots being small chokepoints again.