Mordhau

Firebomb is crap

165 98

One smoke bomb will counter multiple firebombs, even if they are spread out and it also costs 1 point less to get smoke bombs.

Firebombs travel about 5 meters in front of you. so you have to be quite close to use them.

Firebomb projectile hitbox seems huge because it constantly explodes on the bodies of other players or tree branches etc
So many times I aim to the sky for a lobbed shot and some friendly gets hit with it instead.

Then there is a damage which I guess is okay for a 2 point item but the above problems make it pretty much pointless, especially in invasion if that's where the game is going.

All the tool box structures, just need a friendly with a smoke to player as firefighter, what use is the firebomb? Area denial, nope, fireproof is 1 point, the damage scales so it is weak to begin with, seems pointless.

Knight 7664 14060

NA alpha players please recount my exploits so this weirdo will be quiet

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  • 5 Oct
 esturias

The whole concept/balancing around firebombs, smokebombs and constructions is pretty bad in general.
The idea of smokebombs killing fire is just silly to begin with and the firebomb itself started with the same dumb balancing like most other things in the game: "Just give it high damage, the rest is irrelevant." Same problem that we have/had with horses, catapults/balistas, weapons and whatnot.
Now, after the firebomb nerf, it's just a remnant of those times and just used in the clusterfuck that is Invasion.

In short (little suggestion): Firebombs should do even less damage but burn WAY longer, so that it would really count as area denial. That way, one firebomb would also not destroy whole sets of constructions in mere seconds - that's just stupid.
And instead of smokebombs, you'd have buckets of water spawning at random but predefined places that you can pick up, place down again and of course throw at the fire slowly burning down some random stuff.

Knight 925 2541
  • 5 Oct
 Pred

@esturias said:
The idea of smokebombs killing fire is just silly to begin with and the firebomb itself started with the same dumb balancing like most other things in the game: "Just give it high damage, the rest is irrelevant."

What's funny is they were MUCH stronger in alpha, single retard with firebombs could shut down the only populated server whenever he pleased. Damage was higher and ammo crates had no cooldown.

Overall they are fucking awful, mostly used by trolls and idiots who throw them exactly where their team is supposed to go, thinking they are helping. They bring nothing positive to the game and are a staple of terrible decision making devs have been employing around gameplay since forever. But, wait, you can counter them with smoke so it's fine, BECAUSE FIGHTING 100% BLIND IS AWESOME. Pinnacle game design.

165 98

@esturias said:

In short (little suggestion): Firebombs should do even less damage but burn WAY longer, so that it would really count as area denial. That way, one firebomb would also not destroy whole sets of constructions in mere seconds - that's just stupid.
And instead of smokebombs, you'd have buckets of water spawning at random but predefined places that you can pick up, place down again and of course throw at the fire slowly burning down some random stuff.

Without some tool box limits or other structure counters that will buff toolbox buildings indirectly, they are already spamable, repairable and a pain to deal with in tight spaces.

A bucket at the side wouldn't cost anyone any points in their build, so firebomb still seems like a pointless pic with that kind of counter.
A free counter to an item that does very little damage, that you can only carry 3 max before needing to wait for ammo crate reloading, it's already a niche pick.

Probably just needs better designed maps so engineer buildings in invasion aren't so tedious and powerful.

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  • 5 Oct
 esturias

@bobbydigital said:
Without some tool box limits or other structure counters that will buff toolbox buildings indirectly, they are already spamable, repairable and a pain to deal with in tight spaces.

Of course the whole "engineer" part of the game needs quite some fixes, too.

A bucket at the side wouldn't cost anyone any points in their build, so firebomb still seems like a pointless pic with that kind of counter.

A bucket at the side has to be found, carried and used. And it could be balanced by changing the respawn time.

Probably just needs better designed maps so engineer buildings in invasion aren't so tedious and powerful.

Mapdesign is a huge variable of course. That's why I don't like Invasion - it tends to be a serious clusterfuck with 20 players in/on tiny parts of the map.

165 98

Sounds good for the water bucket idea, would fit quite well in to this game.

Knight 762 3296
  • 6 Oct
 Mittsies

Firebombs have been nerfed to the point that fireproof is no longer a necessity, not even in FL/Invasion.

165 98

I guess I am wasting a point still using it.

Standing in the fire for the full time with the perk and it removes about 50% health. Literally mocking the user by standing there on purpose.

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 esturias

@bobbydigital said:
Standing in the fire for the full time with the perk and it removes about 50% health.

That isn't really a problem at all. On the contrary - it's even perfectly fine that way. Not every single item is meant to be a major damage dealer. Exactly that was the problem before. It's like complaining that not every crossbow bolt is a killshot.
The problem with it is that it doesn't have any other real purpose, like area denial.

In short: Remember that you aren't alone in the game, trying to cause damage to enemy players...

1405 1477

@bobbydigital said:
Standing in the fire for the full time with the perk and it removes about 50% health. Literally mocking the user by standing there on purpose.

But if you get directly hit with the projectile it is even more damage. With a headshot it might add up to up to 60 damage! WOW!!!

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@bobbydigital said:
One smoke bomb will counter multiple firebombs, even if they are spread out and it also costs 1 point less to get smoke bombs.
All the tool box structures, just need a friendly with a smoke to player as firefighter, what use is the firebomb? Area denial, nope, fireproof is 1 point, the damage scales so it is weak to begin with, seems pointless.

Smoke bombs don't counter fire bombs at all. I don't know where people keep getting this idea from.

Putting out fires is an interesting gimmick, not an actual useful feature. With smoke bombs, replacing someone's fiery area denial using my cheaper, larger area denial doesn't help anyone. If someone throws fire at my mini-ballista I can put it out - but I still end up having to wait 15 seconds or simply building a new one because I can't see shit.

And as for Fireproof, it's actually fairly bad right now. Fighting in your own fire will get you killed rather quickly, even with Fireproof. The damage simply scales too fast. Fireproof's 80% DR was balanced around the old, constant damage.

165 98

It can be a useful counter to fire, especially if the engineers are spamming buildings that have cost a trip to the ammo crate, the time to rebuild all that vs limited vision.

If the ammo crate isn't ready and is still on cooldown, how long would it then take to build it all again? Run to an ammo crate and repeat.

Smoke bomb has also just removed your fire, so to the user of the firebomb is a direct counter to their intention of either doing aoe damage or putting down means of area denial but most people now just run though it anyway as it will probably only remove 20hp that way.

Baron 14 10
  • 8 Oct
 Tyr

@ToLazy4Name said:
NA alpha players please recount my exploits so this weirdo will be quiet

Do it again i wasnt looking

Knight 7664 14060

@Tyr said:

@ToLazy4Name said:
NA alpha players please recount my exploits so this weirdo will be quiet

Do it again i wasnt looking

I did nothing but throw firepots for at least 3 months of the alpha in an attempt to get the devs to nerf them and it never worked despite me routinely topping the scoreboard against top tier alpha players

now they're finally nerfed and people are complaining about it lmao

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  • 8 Oct
 esturias

@ToLazy4Name said:
now they're finally nerfed and people are complaining about it lmao

Nerfing something isn't the same as balancing something. That should be obvious and not cause your butt falling off from laughing.

Knight 7664 14060

@esturias said:

@ToLazy4Name said:
now they're finally nerfed and people are complaining about it lmao

Nerfing something isn't the same as balancing something. That should be obvious and not cause your butt falling off from laughing.

Fire pots shouldn't exist in the first place, so I don't give much of a shit lmao

1405 1477

@ToLazy4Name said:
Fire pots shouldn't exist in the first place, so I don't give much of a shit lmao

Well, Stouty once thought health regen shouldn't be enabled in small scale skirmishes. But in the end Crush had an incredible convincing argument, that can also be applied to fire pots.
Ready?
Fire pots should be in the game because ...
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they are in the game!

Case closed. ggnore