Mordhau

Some ways to improve horses further

Knight 499 952
  • 1
  • 17 Sep '19
 wierHL

Most of this stuff is copied from my posts in other people's threads.

Beatraps could use more stopping power against horses
These things are designed to hold onto a bear's leg. A horse should be crippled or at least unable to run at full speed after walking into one of these.

Don't apply momentum based dmg to legs
Short high-dmg weapons are being used as counters to cavalry by 1shotting the rider via increased leg dmg. Ideally countering riders should be left to long weapons. As for riders hitting infantry: how often do you even hit infantry legs from horseback?

Apply momentum based dmg from infantry against riders to the front of the rider only
Recently I stabbed a rider as he just got into gear 3 while riding away from me. Felt stupid. I'm not saying there should be less dmg when hitting them in the back, just no bonus.

Make lances (and estoc I guess) the only couchable weapons
Sick and tired of people starting with spears and couching on horses. They're essentially better than lances because they can be used on foot AND serve as a cavalry-counter. Halberds are just as bad if not worse in this regard, which brings me to my next point.

Some weapons should be disallowed completely on horseback
Ever seen someone swing a Zwei or halberd from horseback? Looks ridiculous to me. These are my current thoughts on which weapons should be usable on horseback:

  • Yes: longsword, recurve bow, estoc, Qstaff, medkits, bandages, throwables and any weapon which can be used in 1 hand
  • Arguable: billhook, waraxe, maul, battleaxe, greatsword, poleaxe, peasant "polearms", spear and bardiche (latter 2 not couchable of course)
  • No: halberd, Zwei, longbow and probably toolbox

We need a reliable way to fight with shorter weapons from horseback
Currently swinging from horseback is awkward: 1handed weapons don't offer a lot of reach and hitting anything but other riders is too difficult. Swinging down along the side of the horse tends to result in you hitting your own horse. Hitting infantry pretty much requires using a big/long weapon (which I think shouldn't be usable on a horse anyway) from horseback which makes it easier to hit your horse's head.
I think this is where Mordhau should take a page out of Mount & Blade. It has dedicated swing motions that go along one side of the horse. Additionally the "held" windup animations look very awkward on foot but shine in these downward swings from horseback. Mordhau's current swings/stabs serve well to hit things on the same height as you but it needs some kind of way to lean to one side and attack along the side of the horse. Now I see 2 routes Mordhau could take with this:

  • Leaning attack animations that activate based on mouse movement. I think this would be janky no matter what though, so I'm more inclined to suggest the other route.
  • Make the couch button put the rider in a sort of leaning-to-the-side position. I was thinking of something like pic related but leaning a bit more.

1510568866105.jpg

Couch button (assuming F) would toggle you between upright and leaning position. The lean direction would depend on mouse movement before pressing F. In this position your swings change to the along-the-side swing seen in M&B and it becomes easier to hit infantry. As a trade-off your torso and head become more exposed. If momentum based dmg does not apply to legs, this position also makes attacking groups of infantry more dangerous.

Something else I think would be cool is if the leaning position with 1handed weapons would "ready" your weapon. Essentially attacking from this position would skip windup phase. It's not the same as couching, you'd still have to time your attack, it's more of a pseudo-couch. Hell they could make R switch between a readied swing and stab depending on if you're using like an axe or a rapier. I don't really think this last paragraph is essential, cavalry charging with readied weapons just gives me a boner I guess.

111 97
  • 20 Sep '19
 BOBOLOJOE

some good ideas

leg hits are OK imo. if you are wearing armor on legs it should help.

i think 2 handed weapons shouldn't work on horses

i don't mind bowmen on horses though but shouldn't be able to steer at same time.

of course spears and lances are OK

the above mentioned mods to couching and readying are good

horse should throw you or die if you smash it in the neck with your weapon

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@wierHL said:
Beatraps could use more stopping power against horses
These things are designed to hold onto a bear's leg. A horse should be crippled or at least unable to run at full speed after walking into one of these.

I agree Beartraps would be stronger against horses. At worst, it could dismount the user.

Beartraps are underused right now (not bad, underused), and it's pretty hard to have a horse run on one. Having these being good option against horses would encourage and reward well-placed traps and have a non-expensive (beartraps are only 2 points) way to either trap horses or protect your team's backline (since horses tends to attack your team from the back).

It would also offer an other way to counter horses, instead of only have the corrida-way.

@wierHL said:
Don't apply momentum based dmg to legs
Short high-dmg weapons are being used as counters to cavalry by 1shotting the rider via increased leg dmg. Ideally countering riders should be left to long weapons. As for riders hitting infantry: how often do you even hit infantry legs from horseback?

Question : allowing short-ranged weapons to get close to you isn't the fault of the horse rider ? I'm not sure of how hard is it to get close to and hit a horse with a Short Sword.

@wierHL said:
Apply momentum based dmg from infantry against riders to the front of the rider only
Recently I stabbed a rider as he just got into gear 3 while riding away from me. Felt stupid. I'm not saying there should be less dmg when hitting them in the back, just no bonus.

Agree, considering how the ability to 1 shot horse riders was put in place to allow 1-on-1 fights against horses and simulate increased damage due to momentum. On top of that, it wouldn't be easily exploitable by horse riders since you can't completely turn around.

@wierHL said:
Make lances (and estoc I guess) the only couchable weapons
Sick and tired of people starting with spears and couching on horses. They're essentially better than lances because they can be used on foot AND serve as a cavalry-counter. Halberds are just as bad if not worse in this regard, which brings me to my next point.

Sounds like you are more tired of people using the same thing rather than speaking about how it's a problem. You are punishing every couchable weapon because you don't like one.

Also, there's a problem with your idea : lances cannot be selected from the loadout menu, are limited per map and doesn't respawn. At this point, you could have simply said "Remove counch".

@wierHL said:
Some weapons should be disallowed completely on horseback
Ever seen someone swing a Zwei or halberd from horseback? Looks ridiculous to me.

I have yet to fight on a actual medieval battlefield, but it doesn't look ridiculous to me. Also, you are punishing people that spend more points in their weaponry/found a good weapon. Why don't you have a problem with the spear or eveningstar (for example) ?

@wierHL said:
These are my current thoughts on which weapons should be usable on horseback:

Thoughts that are based on unknown criteria.

@wierHL said:
toolbox

Question : can you build stuff on horseback ?

@wierHL said:
We need a reliable way to fight with shorter weapons from horseback

Even if I still believe long weapons should be better than short ones, I agree fighting on horseback without couching is resumed to either stabs or trying to hit something without giving a new haircut to your horse. A way to lean on the side for non-couchable slash weapons would be welcome.