Mordhau

Stab weapons are flawed by design.

34 23
  • 2
  • 12 Aug
 Aodlop

I don't mean imbalanced, sure you can counter them.
But the isuse lies with the amount (or rather the lack of thereof) of efforts necessary for them to be effective. Someone who is worse than you at the game can still get better results because of how easy it is to stab spam with either a long range weapon like the spear or a very fast one like the rapier.
Both these weapons are very frustrating to play against.
Losing to someone with a greatsword, an axe or a mace doesn't feel bad. He outplayed us, fine, we died, it's okay. Losing to some idiot with a rapier, though? We all know how frustrating it can be. Especially when they start doing this right after: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BAQakz59D_8

Point being: f*ck stab weapons.

850 246

my least favorite is the Stab feighns

205 197
  • 12 Aug
 LoPan

Respectfully disagree. Stabs are the easiest thing to counter imho.

34 23
  • 12 Aug
 Aodlop

Me :

I don't mean imbalanced, sure you can counter them.

You :

Stabs are the easiest thing to counter imho.

1756 1406
  • 12 Aug
 Rergato

If it wasn't the rapier it'd be something else you people would complain about.

205 197
  • 12 Aug
 LoPan

@Aodlop said:
Me :

I don't mean imbalanced, sure you can counter them.

You :

Stabs are the easiest thing to counter imho.

So they aren’t hard to counter. But too easy to use? I don’t know what you’re complaining about? If you are losing to someone just spamming stab the problem is you unfortunately.

1241 3680

DeAr GoD hE hAs A sPeAr I wOnDeR wHaT aTtAcK hEs GoInG tO dO

but seriously if the weapons main source of dmg comes from stabs there PROBABLY going to try to stab you a lot just learn to morph off a chamber and you destroy stab spammers with zero effort

15 9

@TombstoneJack said:
DeAr GoD hE hAs A sPeAr I wOnDeR wHaT aTtAcK hEs GoInG tO dO

but seriously if the weapons main source of dmg comes from stabs there PROBABLY going to try to stab you a lot just learn to morph off a chamber and you destroy stab spammers with zero effort

The problem with this statement is that if you want this game to grow, you can't just consider / balance around high level players, that's a mistake (and yes, I know Mordhau was designed as a competitive offshoot to chivalry).

I think the main issue with stabs is they present a really high skill floor which has created a meta in casual play of just using stab weapons (with or without a shield). This can be frustrating for a lot of new players (who are necessary if you want the game to grow and thrive) as there are a lot of moving parts to learn in this kind of game as you're starting out.

I'd support reworking stabs for this reason and this reason alone. But I also think stabs present a problem at higher levels, not for balance reasons but for utility reasons. Stabs carry the least risk, and have the most reward of any attack type in the game. I wouldn't mind other attacks being buffed or stabs being reworked in some capacity for these reasons.

205 197
  • 12 Aug
 LoPan

@ASeriousSalamander said:

@TombstoneJack said:
DeAr GoD hE hAs A sPeAr I wOnDeR wHaT aTtAcK hEs GoInG tO dO

but seriously if the weapons main source of dmg comes from stabs there PROBABLY going to try to stab you a lot just learn to morph off a chamber and you destroy stab spammers with zero effort

The problem with this statement is that if you want this game to grow, you can't just consider / balance around high level players, that's a mistake (and yes, I know Mordhau was designed as a competitive offshoot to chivalry).

I think the main issue with stabs is they present a really high skill floor which has created a meta in casual play of just using stab weapons (with or without a shield). This can be frustrating for a lot of new players (who are necessary if you want the game to grow and thrive) as there are a lot of moving parts to learn in this kind of game as you're starting out.

I'd support reworking stabs for this reason and this reason alone. But I also think stabs present a problem at higher levels, not for balance reasons but for utility reasons. Stabs carry the least risk, and have the most reward of any attack type in the game. I wouldn't mind other attacks being buffed or stabs being reworked in some capacity for these reasons.

I haven’t met a single high tier player who uses stab more than any other swing type coupled w drags/accels. I think you just play a lot of bad players who beat you w stab spam. That’s just what it sounds like to me.

15 9

@LoPan said:

@ASeriousSalamander said:

@TombstoneJack said:
DeAr GoD hE hAs A sPeAr I wOnDeR wHaT aTtAcK hEs GoInG tO dO

but seriously if the weapons main source of dmg comes from stabs there PROBABLY going to try to stab you a lot just learn to morph off a chamber and you destroy stab spammers with zero effort

The problem with this statement is that if you want this game to grow, you can't just consider / balance around high level players, that's a mistake (and yes, I know Mordhau was designed as a competitive offshoot to chivalry).

I think the main issue with stabs is they present a really high skill floor which has created a meta in casual play of just using stab weapons (with or without a shield). This can be frustrating for a lot of new players (who are necessary if you want the game to grow and thrive) as there are a lot of moving parts to learn in this kind of game as you're starting out.

I'd support reworking stabs for this reason and this reason alone. But I also think stabs present a problem at higher levels, not for balance reasons but for utility reasons. Stabs carry the least risk, and have the most reward of any attack type in the game. I wouldn't mind other attacks being buffed or stabs being reworked in some capacity for these reasons.

I haven’t met a single high tier player who uses stab more than any other swing type coupled w drags/accels. I think you just play a lot of bad players who beat you w stab spam. That’s just what it sounds like to me.

So I really don't want to get into this, because I consider myself a good, but not great player, but I used to play chivalry competitively and I have a fair number of hours in this game, so I by no means have issues with stab spam.

My point was simply that the future of this game also depends on getting new players and growing the community. I will say that most every new player I've met has been frustrated with how easy it is to succeed by simply stab spamming people who don't know how to counter it. And just saying "get good" or "learn how to chamber" is not the right attitude to get people to enjoy / try out the game.

As for high level play, of course no one spams stab, it would be entirely too predictable. My point was simply that stabs offer the most utility out of any attack and I think its relatively undeniable that stab feints and stab morphs are far stronger than their counterparts.

369 552
  • 12 Aug
 smug

As for high level play, of course no one spams stab

Define "spamming stabs" because spears/halbs are important in high level team play lol.

15 9

@smug said:

As for high level play, of course no one spams stab

Define "spamming stabs" because spears/halbs are important in high level team play lol.

That's a good point haha, I meant high level duels you typically have to mix it up.

5 7

@Aodlop said:
I don't mean imbalanced, sure you can counter them.
But the isuse lies with the amount (or rather the lack of thereof) of efforts necessary for them to be effective. Someone who is worse than you at the game can still get better results because of how easy it is to stab spam with either a long range weapon like the spear or a very fast one like the rapier.
Both these weapons are very frustrating to play against.
Losing to someone with a greatsword, an axe or a mace doesn't feel bad. He outplayed us, fine, we died, it's okay. Losing to some idiot with a rapier, though? We all know how frustrating it can be. Especially when they start doing this right after: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BAQakz59D_8

Point being: f*ck stab weapons.

Mace has the most obnoxious stab in the game, closely followed by all the axes. All stabs are within 25 ms of 350 ms release time, stabby weapons are gimped.

31 25
  • 12 Aug
 Demfr

@Aodlop said:
I don't mean imbalanced, sure you can counter them.
But the isuse lies with the amount (or rather the lack of thereof) of efforts necessary for them to be effective. Someone who is worse than you at the game can still get better results because of how easy it is to stab spam with either a long range weapon like the spear or a very fast one like the rapier.
Both these weapons are very frustrating to play against.
Losing to someone with a greatsword, an axe or a mace doesn't feel bad. He outplayed us, fine, we died, it's okay. Losing to some idiot with a rapier, though? We all know how frustrating it can be. Especially when they start doing this right after: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BAQakz59D_8

Point being: f*ck stab weapons.

You cant stomp everybody, and weapons were made so they are easier to use and each weapon have different use. You dont bring a knife to a gun fight. By your state of view every weapon should be same...

15 9

@Archangelo said:

@Aodlop said:
I don't mean imbalanced, sure you can counter them.
But the isuse lies with the amount (or rather the lack of thereof) of efforts necessary for them to be effective. Someone who is worse than you at the game can still get better results because of how easy it is to stab spam with either a long range weapon like the spear or a very fast one like the rapier.
Both these weapons are very frustrating to play against.
Losing to someone with a greatsword, an axe or a mace doesn't feel bad. He outplayed us, fine, we died, it's okay. Losing to some idiot with a rapier, though? We all know how frustrating it can be. Especially when they start doing this right after: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BAQakz59D_8

Point being: f*ck stab weapons.

Mace has the most obnoxious stab in the game, closely followed by all the axes. All stabs are within 25 ms of 350 ms release time, stabby weapons are gimped.

I really dislike this too actually. I get that it's a utility stab that doesn't do much damage, but I'd much rather they slow these particular stabs down a touch and buff other aspects of the weapon if need be.