Mordhau

Mordhau combat bores me

Duke 2266 4007
  • 1
  • 15 Sep '18
 Huggles

Mordhau is way less forgiving for noobs imo due to the absence of hit trades and more ways to deal with feints.

In chiv feinting being incredibly easy to execute yet hard to read and being able to do damage despite fucking up (trades) were extremely noob friendly mechanics. It allowed any average joe to land a hit on a veteran player by just sow stab feinting and having an exorcism with their mouse or smthn. Or just use norse. In mordhau the only noob friendly mechanic is chambering to essentially avoid reading but it is inherently detrimental now so...and in a way it is also not noob friendly as a far more experienced player can not give a fuck about stamina at all and come out on top due to proper positioning and pressuring and breaking to regen stamina mid fight.

I think if mordhau wants to look and feel even more fun than it is now the devs should focus a lot on swing manipulation and try to make it as fun and fluid as possible while making it look better. The appeal to me in these types of games was always feeling like I was the main driver of my attacks as monsteri said, however it seems to me that the state of the game is pretty damn good atm. It would be really cool to see swing manipulation revamped and made more vital though.

Knight 334 777
  • 2
  • 17 Sep '18
 AngelEyes

@Seseau said:
I would lay money on the fact that most people bought and enjoyed Chivalry because it made them feel like a medieval warrior.

I do believe this has implications way deeper than some would like to admit. Because I think it makes the debate end too easily.

I know it's why I played it. I'm also convinced it's the sole purpose that the game never saw mostly negative reviews, the majority of any games population are casual gamers. Before the meta evolved chiv was a great casual game and the meta had not yet developed, Bobby Joe played for about maybe 10-50 hours left a thumbs up then moved on to the next big thing.

TB should make a robot space ninja sequel to chiv to put in in context so its mechanics can make sense.

239 289
  • 1
  • 17 Sep '18
 idiotgod

What I meant by nub friendly is that it is easier to jump in and at least feel competent. It doesn't take a huge amount of hours to be able to at least survive for a bit against much better players.

It is easy to see how this is, when you have all your moves mapped out for you, where as in chiv, you had to figure out how to move your feet and your mouse at the same time, which is extremely difficult for a nub to understand. It takes like a hundred hours to even understand why you are being hit in Chivalry. As a dev I understand why you wouldn't want this. But as a player I personally really enjoy that kind of experience.

@Huggles said:

I think if mordhau wants to look and feel even more fun than it is now the devs should focus a lot on swing manipulation and try to make it as fun and fluid as possible while making it look better. The appeal to me in these types of games was always feeling like I was the main driver of my attacks as monsteri said, however it seems to me that the state of the game is pretty damn good atm. It would be really cool to see swing manipulation revamped and made more vital though.

This is what I am trying to say. I think more people feel this way than we're seeing talk about it, cause they don't know how to say it, and if you say something wrong on this forum you get shit on and made to feel like a nub idiot lol. So I think a lot more people are feeling this, and I want the devs to realize.

301 875
  • 17 Sep '18
 Naleaus

@idiotgod said:
What I meant by nub friendly is that it is easier to jump in and at least feel competent. It doesn't take a huge amount of hours to be able to at least survive for a bit against much better players.

It is easy to see how this is, when you have all your moves mapped out for you, where as in chiv, you had to figure out how to move your feet and your mouse at the same time, which is extremely difficult for a nub to understand. It takes like a hundred hours to even understand why you are being hit in Chivalry.

From my experience in the alpha currently this isn't really true at all. New players even when a hundred hours or so, get absolutely demolished still. There are a few exceptions, but they're definitely not the norm. You make the game sound like it has static moves or something.

and if you say something wrong on this forum you get shit on and made to feel like a nub idiot lol. So I think a lot more people are feeling this, and I want the devs to realize.

It's mostly just the OP, at least for me. He's had consistently dumb posts. I think my replies to you were mostly civil, I just corrected or had a differing opinion on most everything.

Sellsword 203 244
  • 17 Sep '18
 Redeaux

I like the new changes so far, I just really want to have the ability to chain attacks with all weapons. Its really makes these weapons a clankfest to use. Let me do executioner chains and I will be content. Also remove first hit flinch from really asymmetric scenarios, like a dude punching a guy swinging a maul, the maul should still connect. Outside of these two complaints, I dont see any issues. I barely try and still kill fools, I suck btw.

Baron 1551 2083
  • 1
  • 19 Sep '18
 yourcrippledson

@Naleaus said:
You can even use 240 if you really wanted for even more control over making your attack look like absolute shit.

Cause in the end that's really all either game comes down to. Scare your opponent into parrying by making your attack look hideous. You like pressing a button then moving your mouse. Some people like pressing multiple buttons. Some combine the two for some real emergent gameplay.

"In the end it's all about making your attack look like shit" - liked by a dev.

Yeah you get angry cause you literally don't even understand what i am saying. You literally don't even know what emergent gameplay is. If you think pushing buttons in a different order is emergent, you're a fucking idiot.

Emergent gameplay is when you do something you didn't even know you could do before. Maybe something that not even the devs knew you could do, whether they designed the game to be emergent or not, this is how playstyles really diversify, and what I was really hoping the devs of mordhau would appreciate from chivalry and focus on in Mordhau. But that is not a thing in Mordhau and it seems like it never will be. You seem to think moments like when you discover "Oh wow i didn't think of chambering then morphing then feinting before." Are emergent enough lol what a joke. The system is confining and limiting so there is no such thing as an emergent piece of gameplay.

Now to get personal. You had like 3 times my hours in chiv and I was better than you, so you clearly didn't have the ability to take full advantage of the system. So i can see why you'd be so defensive of a system designed to limit someone like me, who has the ability to go beyond it.

301 875
  • 20 Sep '18
 Naleaus

@yourcrippledson said:

@Naleaus said:
You can even use 240 if you really wanted for even more control over making your attack look like absolute shit.

Cause in the end that's really all either game comes down to. Scare your opponent into parrying by making your attack look hideous. You like pressing a button then moving your mouse. Some people like pressing multiple buttons. Some combine the two for some real emergent gameplay.

"In the end it's all about making your attack look like shit" - liked by a dev.

Yippee, you can't understand hyperbole.

Yeah you get angry cause you literally don't even understand what i am saying. You literally don't even know what emergent gameplay is. If you think pushing buttons in a different order is emergent, you're a fucking idiot.

Are you so shit at the game that you press a button and just stare at the screen standing still? You literally have more options to do what you want in Mordhau.

Oh no, they're going to parry my attack! What can I do?
Chiv: Drag, Feint, 3 attacks.
Mordhau: Drag, Feint, Morph, 4 attacks, 240 control system for more control if you really want it.

Your idea of emergent is, move your mouse cause they were going to parry your attack. You can do that in Mordhau too, if not as easily. You can also morph your attack then drag. How is that not more emergent? Please explain since I don't understand you. Is it cause you can't float your attack the entire length of a parry?

Emergent gameplay is when you do something you didn't even know you could do before. Maybe something that not even the devs knew you could do, whether they designed the game to be emergent or not, this is how playstyles really diversify, and what I was really hoping the devs of mordhau would appreciate from chivalry and focus on in Mordhau. But that is not a thing in Mordhau and it seems like it never will be. You seem to think moments like when you discover "Oh wow i didn't think of chambering then morphing then feinting before." Are emergent enough lol what a joke. The system is confining and limiting so there is no such thing as an emergent piece of gameplay.

Oh no, I don't do emergent shit, I must be bad. Oh wait.
https://gfycat.com/WeepyBlankCoyote
https://gfycat.com/VelvetyHotGoral
https://gfycat.com/GorgeousSpitefulAmethystgemclam

Maybe you're just mad cause you can't crutch on your experience from Chiv?

Now to get personal. You had like 3 times my hours in chiv and I was better than you, so you clearly didn't have the ability to take full advantage of the system. So i can see why you'd be so defensive of a system designed to limit someone like me, who has the ability to go beyond it.

Or maybe you were bad at Chivalry too. All I remember of you in Chiv were random duel mode servers and you rage quitting often. Fun claims though, did you play against bots in Chiv too? Really going beyond that system, let me tell you.

Conscript 9 6
  • 2
  • 21 Sep '18
 ApartmentDJ

I have to agree. I hope they tone down drags as it's seems to be such a big part of the game but doesn't feel particularly skill heavy. Not to mention some of it would tear your back muscles if done with the heavier weapons.

Mercenary 1122 2056
  • 21 Sep '18
 TheKingInTheNorth

@ApartmentDJ said:
I have to agree. I hope they tone down drags as it's seems to be such a big part of the game but doesn't feel particularly skill heavy. Not to mention some of it would tear your back muscles if done with the heavier weapons.

Drags have been nerfed to death already, most weapons can barely do them and the ones that can are usually expensive.

80 201
  • 21 Sep '18
 Seseau

Drags, as visually unintuitive as they can be to the new player, are indeed a necessary mechanic. The real problem is animations. They're just not very good.

Knight 925 2541
  • 21 Sep '18
 Pred

Stab drags have been overnerfed by timing adjustments and the animation is bad, resulting in ghost swings at the end of the stab.

Delayed strikes kinda work, but not as well as they should because of the gamble-to-FTP defensive meta.

Side hits were supposed to be easier this patch, but they seem much harder, for 2h weapons at least? Parry box seems clunky. I don't attempt them anymore, just feint and morph feint like a madman.

People with 1H I just actively avoid, no point getting frustrated.

Yeah, 1v1 combat for me is extremely boring now. Don't agree with any of the OP points though.

Count 449 1186
  • 26 Nov '18
 Hadeus

Mordhau has a discouragingly steep learning curve due to its intricate combat system. Nothing else has anywhere near the mechanical depth or freedom of control that Mordhau has. This is what makes Mordhau so addicting and unique. The game rewards those that put in the time and effort to master the mechanics; But, on the flipside, many new players quit the game due to frustration & lack of direction (or knowledge).

I have witnessed many players and [chiv] veterans fall victim to this because they are still looking at Mordhau strictly through the lense of Chivalry. In Chivalry, the same concept above applied....but there were fewer moves or options to choose from. Not only is there more moves but there are more animation frames to actually react to attacks.

Chiv: Drag, Feint, 3 attacks.
Mordhau: Drag, Feint, Morph, 4 attacks, 240 control system for more control if you really want it.

...Also Chambers.

The combination of said Mordhau mechanics actually make Mordhau produce more 'Emergent Gameplay' than Chivalry ever did.

1 0
  • 27 Nov '18
 DeminRamst

just glanced the thread. seems like a giant shitshow.

@Anal Error said:
And still no double KO chance in this game... boring as shitt whitout...

double KO as in one swing can hit two people? i'm pretty sure that is a massively gamey mechanic. in real life, killing 2 people with 1 swing requires that you hit unarmoured foes with the right weapon. even light armoured classes would be at least wearing gambison. the first person you hit would more commonly make any attack lose its momentum hitting the first guy, with not enough momentum remaining to penetrate armour meaningfully on the second bloke. i can imagine this game will have armour. chiv gave it a go, why not let this game further expand on a closer mimic to medieval combat?

Duke 5483 13094
  • 27 Nov '18
 Jax — Community Manager

Demin he's a meme just leave him alone, we're not adding hit trading to the game. It would destroy the gameplay.

Duchess 6865 9830
  • 27 Nov '18
 Sir Zombie

@DeminRamst said:
just glanced the thread. seems like a giant shitshow.

@Anal Error said:
And still no double KO chance in this game... boring as shitt whitout...

double KO as in one swing can hit two people? i'm pretty sure that is a massively gamey mechanic. in real life, killing 2 people with 1 swing requires that you hit unarmoured foes with the right weapon. even light armoured classes would be at least wearing gambison. the first person you hit would more commonly make any attack lose its momentum hitting the first guy, with not enough momentum remaining to penetrate armour meaningfully on the second bloke. i can imagine this game will have armour. chiv gave it a go, why not let this game further expand on a closer mimic to medieval combat?

Double ko is two people killing each other at the same time. What you are talking about is already in the game and it really isnt a simulator for medieval combat.