Mordhau

The anti-keybind crusade

Count 791 3016
  • 6 Jun '18
 EatAtRedLobster

At this point removing either input method is a winless scenario for the devs which would alienate either one large group or another. It is quite literally the worst available option, and the laziest "fix" possible. Regardless of what tweaks we feel need to be made to 240, the people who call for the removal of keybinds to make up for the shortcomings of 240 are being shortsighted. They are self interested and putting their own desires ahead of their fellow players, and ahead of the playability of the game itself.

What some of you people are suggesting is akin to taking Keybinds into the woods and executing it for doing it's job well, so 240 doesn't have to feel bad about itself. Just improve the substandard 240 system.

I find it rather telling that some people in their blind pursuit to "balance" the game by removing keybinds don't seem to care that some of us also donated to the kickstarter with the understanding that keybinds would be one of the two input methods.

TL;DR People should stop calling to remove either input method. Maximum freedom of input and more refined 240 is the solution. We should be able to bind 240 system to a wheel controller, keybinds to foot pedals, and feint to the horn. Oh, and you should eat at Red Lobster etc.

Conscript 4546 6279
  • 6 Jun '18
 vanguard

@yourcrippledson said:
https://youtu.be/SB4hfIMJg2Q?t=14

see the first strike in the video after my timestamp, (right after the kick). Watch it in slow-mo if you have a slow brain like me or Rob. It doesn't look like a perfectly horizontal strike to me. It is altered slightly to be sure not to hit his team mate in the head, and using the best possible angle to hit the enemy. Fine adjustments like this are what the 240 brings that binds can never offer.

Even if this isn't the best example, this is just one type of situation I use 240 for. Why do you want to make weapon control worse?

This advantage is meaningless, as you can do the exact same thing with perfectly horizontal cuts, even back in chivalry this was possible. There are no advantages tbh, it's just, imho, a more fun way to play the game.

All these angles are useless tbh and Monsteri nailed it imho, not worth to have this highly marginal "advantage" if the price you pay is randomness. Fuck, I'd be really willing to test Monsteri's idea, it sounds like it would make the game so much better to play with the 240 system.

Baron 1551 2083
  • 6 Jun '18
 yourcrippledson

@Stouty said:

@yourcrippledson said:

@Stouty said:
I tried using both directional and binds since slasher but it will never be as powerful as pure binds, if you have 6 dedicated buttons for each attack (preferably all on the mouse) then there is 0 reason to have directional as well

you lack creativity i guess

you would get trashed

Only the most High IQ arguments from Stouty, as usual.

1308 2875
  • 6 Jun '18
 Monsteri

@yourcrippledson said:
https://youtu.be/SB4hfIMJg2Q?t=14

see the first strike in the video after my timestamp, (right after the kick). Watch it in slow-mo if you have a slow brain like me or Rob. It doesn't look like a perfectly horizontal strike to me. It is altered slightly to be sure not to hit his team mate in the head, and using the best possible angle to hit the enemy. Fine adjustments like this are what the 240 brings that binds can never offer.

You can do the same thing with a normal slash and swing manipulation.

Baron 1551 2083
  • 6 Jun '18
 yourcrippledson

@Monsteri said:

@yourcrippledson said:
https://youtu.be/SB4hfIMJg2Q?t=14

see the first strike in the video after my timestamp, (right after the kick). Watch it in slow-mo if you have a slow brain like me or Rob. It doesn't look like a perfectly horizontal strike to me. It is altered slightly to be sure not to hit his team mate in the head, and using the best possible angle to hit the enemy. Fine adjustments like this are what the 240 brings that binds can never offer.

You can do the same thing with a normal slash and swing manipulation.

You can ALMOST do the same thing, but not the exact same thing. Looking past this one specific example, this is a useful thing to be able to do, and I use it all the time.

Duke 2266 4007
  • 6 Jun '18
 Huggles

@Stouty said:

@yourcrippledson said:

@Punzybobo said:
Your argument falls apart when you realize that the 240 system is not a useful tool. No offense to the devs.

It compliments my bind setup wonderfully and It is the one thing that makes mordhau controls better than Chivalry controls.

But you'd get trashed by a decent bind player and you would never reach a top level of play with 240. If that doesn't interest you that's fine too

That's not true. There are many very good players that use 240. However, they would be even better if they used binds.

Binds are an advantage, but to say you can't git gud with 240 is disingenuous.

Baron 1551 2083
  • 7 Jun '18
 yourcrippledson

Make another "checkbox" or "bind" that allows you to only have 6 angles with 240. If it's a bind you could have 6 angle input and 240 available at the same time. And if it is at least a checkbox you can have your 6 angle mouse input, without ruining my 240 fun :)

1084 6143
  • 1
  • 7 Jun '18
 crushed — Art

Neither will be removed and binds will not be touched. 240 system is being improved, and the upcoming crosshair makes it much better aswell.

Duchess 774 3449
  • 7 Jun '18
 Stouty

@Huggles said:

@Stouty said:

@yourcrippledson said:

@Punzybobo said:
Your argument falls apart when you realize that the 240 system is not a useful tool. No offense to the devs.

It compliments my bind setup wonderfully and It is the one thing that makes mordhau controls better than Chivalry controls.

But you'd get trashed by a decent bind player and you would never reach a top level of play with 240. If that doesn't interest you that's fine too

That's not true. There are many very good players that use 240. However, they would be even better if they used binds.

Binds are an advantage, but to say you can't git gud with 240 is disingenuous.

That's what I said and this guy isn't one of them

Baron 1551 2083
  • 7 Jun '18
 yourcrippledson

@Stouty said:

@Huggles said:

@Stouty said:

@yourcrippledson said:

@Punzybobo said:
Your argument falls apart when you realize that the 240 system is not a useful tool. No offense to the devs.

It compliments my bind setup wonderfully and It is the one thing that makes mordhau controls better than Chivalry controls.

But you'd get trashed by a decent bind player and you would never reach a top level of play with 240. If that doesn't interest you that's fine too

That's not true. There are many very good players that use 240. However, they would be even better if they used binds.

Binds are an advantage, but to say you can't git gud with 240 is disingenuous.

That's what I said and this guy isn't one of them

We can't all have an IQ as objectively impressive as yours.

Duchess 774 3449
  • 7 Jun '18
 Stouty

Go ft10

Knight 123 262
  • 7 Jun '18
 Vin¢

If the skill gap is really that bad, then a good solution might be to advertise (in tutorials / guides) that 240 is more intuitive but worse, whereas binds are less intuitive than better.

Doing it like this is fine; the noobs who just want the 240 feel will know upfront what they’re choosing and won’t complain as much when they get rekt by the binds users. Having alternative control schemes, some of which are superior, is totally fine and has worked in a lot of other games so I don’t think either needs to be removed.

Final pro tip, it’s not hard to relearn the other system even with a few hundred hours in the game. I have about 250 hours in total, and for the first 100 I was using 240 but then swapped to binds. So don’t feel like switching is too much of a stretch.

TL;DR People won’t be salty about the skill gap if it’s made clear up front that 240 is inferior (at least as it exists at the moment).

Knight 222 187
  • 7 Jun '18
 REKTKWONDO

@Prince Oberyn Martell said:
Just wanna throw it out there that JUNE uses a FOOT PEDAL as one of his binds for chambering.

Yeah I use djembé so wassup

Knight 292 904
  • 1
  • 8 Jun '18
 GIRUGIRU

I can see 240 being superior for duelists because the angles can be deceptive sometimes, input delay isn't really an issue in 1v1s

I said from the start 240 will always be inferior unless it has it's own merits (such as deceptive angles) but the input delay is not enough to justify that, as well as the extra mouse movement you have to "waste" which should be used for swing manipulation

I personally think the default layout should just be Chiv controls + 160(slashes and undercuts). 240 always felt like shit to me and i'd hate to use it, just makes the game clunky and ontop of that, 240 players look way too spasticated with janky camera movements flying their mouse all around the show trying to input the correct attacks. Can instantly identify a 240 spaz compared to some disciplined bind-titan

396 453
  • 8 Jun '18
 JasonBourne

@GIRUGIRU said:
..240 players look way too spasticated with janky camera movements flying their mouse all around the show trying to input the correct attacks. Can instantly identify a 240 spaz compared to some disciplined bind-titan

"You can do micro mouse movements, so you wont notice anything. 1mm mouse movement is enough" - Crush