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Alpha Build #14 Discussion Thread

Mercenary 2193 3914
  • 26 Mar '18
 EruTheTeapot

You again ?

Duchess 6897 9885
  • 26 Mar '18
 Sir Zombie

@Kingindian said:
The game feels like shit to play. Very sluggish and slow paced gameplay.
Not sure what is wrong iwth feint either, maybe nothing. But the little i have played since the game is just boring as fuck to play, feint seems wrong, you are supposed to only be able to feint when you charge an attack or a strong attack.

But feint aside, the overall gameplay feels bad.

Are you talking about For Honor?

Knight 79 157
  • 26 Mar '18
 Netherim

@Kingindian said:
The game feels like shit to play. Very sluggish and slow paced gameplay.
Not sure what is wrong iwth feint either, maybe nothing. But the little i have played since the game is just boring as fuck to play, feint seems wrong, you are supposed to only be able to feint when you charge an attack or a strong attack.

But feint aside, the overall gameplay feels bad.

Slow paced? Lol good luck fighting against the rest of 1h weps/short grips in this game

Duchess 806 3550
  • 26 Mar '18
 Stouty

Is it just me or is everyone's head cocked to one side quizzically in this patch

db19f1ca7783495cf133c5754cb63de0.png

Duke 5558 13284
  • 27 Mar '18
 Jax — Community Manager

ye fockin w0t m8

Count 164 304
  • 27 Mar '18
 ColonelMustache

Oh my god you can just straight up equip the wooden mallet and rocks now I love you. I hope more environmental weapons get added to the equip list for shits and giggles. I think this patch will be the push I need to play this game again.

200 37
  • 1
  • 27 Mar '18
 Kingindian

@Netherim said:

@Kingindian said:
The game feels like shit to play. Very sluggish and slow paced gameplay.
Not sure what is wrong iwth feint either, maybe nothing. But the little i have played since the game is just boring as fuck to play, feint seems wrong, you are supposed to only be able to feint when you charge an attack or a strong attack.

But feint aside, the overall gameplay feels bad.

Slow paced? Lol good luck fighting against the rest of 1h weps/short grips in this game

It feels slowplaced, doesnt matter which weapon someone has. And ye it feels sluggish aswell. Why cant you undestand this simple critique, are you that stupid?
Zionists own this world, time to fucking wake up.

Uninstalled after 30min yet again.
Doubt it will change but something THAT WILL CHANGE IS THAT THE GOOD PEOPLE START TO WAKE THE FUCK UP

Rockefeller medicine is a good start. Its poision. All of it.

Duke 341 974
  • 27 Mar '18
 Ruby Rhoderick

Overall, I've been having a lot of fun with this patch and I think that most of what was changed/implemented benefits the game, but I do think there are issues that need to be addressed.

First, thank you so much for adding a queue to join full servers, not that it was an issue with the low player count, but it'll be nice to have when the game releases.

I'm enjoying the changes to blunt weapons, I applaud the developers for going against the majority and experimenting with new mechanics. This is one of those instances where something in idea may sound terrible, but once implemented is surprisingly good for the game. It helps to differentiate the weapons and make blunt weapons feel unique.

That said, I'm not entirely a fan of the changes to HTK with a lot of the weapons. It makes them all feel more alike and often I find it difficult to justify the more expensive weapons when I could go LS and deal nearly just as much damage. Sure, if we compare the GS to the LS, it does have better reach, but it's negligible.

I do not like how extreme some of the accels are right now. They were bad before and now I think they're worse. I feel like I'm playing a reaction simulator rather than a game about skill. I feel like I cheated my opponent when I accel my attacks, sometimes there's just no time for them to react.

Probably one of the most infuriating mechanics of the game right now though is the ability to disengage and run to avoid attacks. I know you all have a hard-on for dodging attacks, but if you make a mistake and throw out a mistimed parry, you absolutely should not be able to just run away to avoid the mistake. Yes, allow us to bend, twist, or duck our bodies to avoid attacks, but it looks ridiculous when you can just run away from your mistakes.

One more thing: when vision is obscured by smoke, remove the nametags from appearing at the bottom of the screen. Otherwise, you’ll have players that just spin around in the smoke until an enemy nametag appears, track it, and be able to attack out of the smoke. It’s more effective than you’d think.

Knight 5410 7408
  • 27 Mar '18
 Humble Staff

i agree with the several coments about being able to just turn around and run from your enemy's attacks when you fuck up, i didn't like it in chivalry and i don't like it here, i don't know if there is a solution that wont hurt the rest of the game but if there is, please consider it.

Knight 941 2569
  • 27 Mar '18
 Pred

@das said:
Maul is excellent.

Whoa, that's what happens when players starved for 2.5 months and blinded by nostalgia are too quick to comment a on new release, amirite ;)

Maul is a joke. Awful addition in this state.

Knight 292 904
  • 27 Mar '18
 GIRUGIRU

fucking love maul

Knight 24 107
  • 1
  • 28 Mar '18
 Doppelsöldner

@GIRUGIRU said:
fucking love maul

And he loves you

maul_smile.gif

Knight 941 2569
  • 3
  • 29 Mar '18
 Pred

K, I have actually played some M to the ordhau. Only have a shitty laptop and wi-fi now so it's possible some things that seem very bad for me work better on a decent setup, I dunno.

Chambers feel better than ever right now, when I input a chamber that feels good at the beginning, usually means it's very likely to work now.

Footwork and speed I rate very bad, even worse than before. Running around and running away is awful. Awful, awful, awful. When you panic parry or fall for a feint your only available options should be to backpedal and try to matrix to the side or double parry, not put your face into the ground and run. When you have 5-8 people fighting (team mode) in a medium sized area they should naturally form smaller group fights, between which you could change when the timing is right. Now if you have a 4v4 it's probably everyone in an equal distance from each other, target switching like crazy pinballs. Like, if you land one hit on a guy, the most viable option for now is to immediately look for someone else it seems.

There should be a a better way to punish misses, I think some people started to pick up that if you are going to get parried, with some weapons it's better to intentionally miss so you can play the Am-I-Going-To-Accel? game again instead of giving up the initiative.

Zweihander still most absurd weapon. Coupled with its mandatory light builds, which are crazy fast, it's like it's begging you to play like a retard let out of a cage.

Maul feels like a step back in the sense making department. Too much damage to heavy armor, pretty cancerous stab, too fast. Should not be possible to accelerate. I think it should be a support weapon for flanking with high damage and feeling cool because you have a big hammer, not something you can demolish in group fight or bring into a 1v1.

Problems I have with some feints were confirmed by Crush to be on the list, so no comments here.

Shields - I know they are better than they were, but if they are OK I can't tell. It's hard to say because it's hard to distinguish if the setup feels broken because of the shield itself or because of broken weapons that are paired with shields. As I said, I play on laptop and wi-fi now, and I'm having MASSIVE problems dealing with 1 handers defensively. That is, in some kind of ways that make sense, so barring just running away at every swing.

While I find stab drags somewhat necessary and fine if they are not over the top, the most obnoxious ones are still there. Sky and groundstabs still look horrible. Also parrying the rainbow stab Kirbone does all the time with halberd feels like a coin toss, really. You can lean back, concentrate 100%, but at some point it just goes through your face and you have to decide if you RMB now or look to the other shoulder.

Hit stop and recovery I already said I'm not a fan of.

There is too much flinch in the game which is extremely annoying. I think smaller projectiles should not flinch at all and bigger ones maybe not flinch everyone. For example arming sword throw would not flinch T3 armor or maybe only on headshots? Also team hit flinch could be removed for the sake of gameplay. I'm already taking a hit from a teammate for damage AND I am flinched AND if I'm fighting someone I have to put myself at risk to check what is going on behind me, if I'm getting ganked. Kind of a big punishment for somebody's mistake and it will be even more magnified in the regular game, when you have slashing noobs playing.

367 341
  • 30 Mar '18
 Peacerer

@Pred said:
Shields - I know they are better than they were, but if they are OK I can't tell.

You know that they are WORSE(!) than they were, but its hard to say whether they are nerfed enough to be ok?!?

Duchess 806 3550
  • 2
  • 30 Mar '18
 Stouty

Hit stop on blunt weps is very bad imo, reminds me of this. I get that it's meant to add weight to the hits but for me it does the exact opposite, it feels like somebody replaced my metal mace with a rubber replica and only the killing blow is satisfying to land

It's also very confusing from a gameplay perspective and fucks with 1vX

Knight 941 2569
  • 30 Mar '18
 Pred

Don't like the new piano music. Piano sounds very non-medieval.

Needs more throat singing and drums.

Knight 685 1855
  • 30 Mar '18
 ÐMontyleGueux

@Stouty said:
It's also very confusing from a gameplay perspective and fucks with 1vX

I've managed to win a 3v1 with a longsword's alt grip recently, I didn't feel like the hit stop was a problem. It's even better in some cases since I've been able to target switch faster thanks to the hit stop.

I love that mechanic, the only problem I have with it is the transition between the hit stop animation and the next attack of the combo, which makes it really hard to tell what your opponent is doing. For example whenever I get hit with a warhammer I always fail to parry the following attack, I never see it coming.

Knight 941 2569
  • 31 Mar '18
 Pred

What it looks like when you parry a rock and get knocked two steps back:

Superman-vs-locomotive-01.jpg

Knight 627 2068
  • 1
  • 2 Apr '18
 LuxCandidus

I do not think the game is in a good spot currently.

  • Attacks are way too fast. The release portion of attacks has always been too short, but as of this patch it is even shorter. This makes even attacks with little acceleration to them feel too quick to react to, let alone chamber. The instant attack problem plaguing the game has only been exacerbated. You can now lock players in a perpetual flinched state.

  • Parrying feels unreliable. Other than it requiring more precision, I cannot put my finger on what about it has changed, but here is some feedback: It no longer feels instant - It feels like if an attack hits me during the first few frames of my parry I will take damage. A lot of the time it also seems like the parry animation plays right after I take a hit. The absurd speed of certain attacks also means it is not always possible to parry in time unless your reaction time is highly above average. For a basic mechanic this is overkill. It was fine in the previous patch.

  • Weapon balance is all over the place. Heavy, costly weapons like the battleaxe and eveningstar have instant stabs, small arms like the rapier and mace can either kill you in two hits or two seconds. Note that the issue here is not how weak or powerful a certain weapon is, but how weapons are balanced relative to one another. For instance, the difference between slow and fast weapons is meagre, largely due to how much attacks can be accelerated, so there is less incentive to take a weapon because it is faster. Similarly, taking a weapon such as the eveningstar due to its damage is also pointless when the mace and warhammer are just as powerful at half the cost.
    I know there are nuances such as turn cap and morph cost that differentiate weapons further, but the balance seems no less questionable. I have a suggestion: Give each weapon a brief description. This will also help new players understand the idea behind certain weapons without requiring them to look at the highly technical list of values below the weapon (which would probably intimidate them if it was all they had to base their choice of weapon on).

  • EDIT: Stab drags are horrendous. They genuinely look like an exploit and range from unrealistic to absolutely undecipherable. I assume the only reason they exist is so chambering stabs does not become trivial, but virtually any other solution would be better than tolerating stab drags in their current state.

  • Feint woes. I will save it for the next patch in which feints will be altered, but there is still something on my mind: A while ago someone pointed out attacks require very little commitment as you can cancel out of them for the majority of their duration, which makes it very difficult to punish players who miss an attack or exercise poor judgement in when to perform an attack. Moreover it means players can attack at the same time as their opponent, and if they are about to be hit first, they can simply feint-to-parry. This does promote gambling and a playstyle in which the opponent's actions matter less, though I do not see how it can be fixed without the player's control over their character being severely limited. I am interested to hear if others have thought of any solutions so far.

  • Shields are still a chore to fight. This issue might be the hardest to correct. There are quite a few discussions on this already.

  • projectile spam is horrendous. Definitely limit the number of smoke bombs / fire bombs the player spawns with. In the future it would be nice to also make them cost a lot more unless the player has a "support / strategist" perk which makes such equipment much cheaper but in exchange you will lack perk points for other goodies. People seem to be of the opinion the projectile spam will die down once they are no longer new, but I highly doubt that. There will always be players who find it hilarious to run around and bombard the map with smoke and fire. Furthermore, there will always be new players for whom the idea is still fresh and novel.

Before you tell me none of these are issues once you have put six billion hours into the game, take a moment to consider how new players would feel about some of these mechanics in their current state and whether they would be motivated to put even ten hours into the game.

And keep in mind also that it is possible to correct a broken mechanic without it becoming so simple that even new players would master it in five minutes. A lot of you struggle with that concept.

Knight 941 2569
  • 2 Apr '18
 Pred

@LuxCandidus said:
A while ago someone pointed out attacks require very little commitment as you can cancel out of them for the majority of their duration, which makes it very difficult to punish players who miss an attack or exercise poor judgement in when to perform an attack. Moreover it means players can attack at the same time as their opponent, and if they are about to be hit first, they can simply feint-to-parry. This does promote gambling and a playstyle in which the opponent's actions matter less, though I do not see how it can be fixed without the player's control over their character being severely limited. I am interested to hear if others have thought of any solutions so far.

Yeah, I think this is massively exacerbated by insta-FTP, I'm still puzzled why devs chose to implement it over the manual one tbh.

Another thing is that with many weapons you don't even have to CFTP if you miss, much better to just combo. Feinting CFTP worked like a charm at the beginning when everyone still had strong habits form Chiv, now you are probably more likely to eat a hit when you do that.