Mordhau

The animations rework and more

Conscript 4564 6302
  • 3
  • 18 Dec '17
 vanguard

So guys, what is it all about? It is in dare need imho, as reading the difference between a accelerated attack and a delayed is completely cancer at the moment and a borderline gamble against some weapons.

I honestly don`t know what can be done about it. I chiv, the weapons didn't had a fluid trajectory like in mordhau, but this allowed for somehow you reading when someone would delay or accelerate like, delayed attacks literally froze in your face so you knew what was going to happen, altough it did looked ridiculous.

In mordhau it is way too subtle imho, specially with horizontal cuts and stabs. Stabs are the biggest offenders really, its goddamn impossible to know what the fuck you are dealing with if your opponent actually knows how to properly drag a stab. Those stabs that start basically inside you, then your opponent drag that shit last second and your chamber atempt goes to hell with your mental health as well. I find myself having to predict what my opponent is going to do instead of properly reacting.

I fucking hate footdrags as well, as they can look like accelerations easily even with the new attack angle thing. When the attack is on your FoV, it looks like a accelerated or a normal attack, but then you just drag it a bit to the side, it goes out of your opponent`s fov and by this time, if he is trying to chamber or parry, he is already fucked, so you better predict when a foothit is about to come. I'm not talking here about nooby footdrags telegraphed as fuck that you read miles away, I'm talking about real goddamn footdrags that REALLY looks like a normal or accelerated attack. It is cancer.

I also experienced something funny, I got hit by a delayed attack and the follow up was a accelerated one, and I could do fuckall about it, just eat the hit. This is dumb beyond imagination pls, I like to think it was internet or mental lag idk. If this is true, pls fix man is broken.

Another thing, Bodkin mentioned in a thread something about the lunge foward in small-medium weapons being too good, and I find that to be true. It basically nulfies any advantage a halberd might have over a longsword or messer. I find that totally unecessary to be as it is now. The lunge as a idea is fine and necessary, but needs to be nerfed on a few weapons imho in order to make reach something important again, its too damn risky to make range plays on this game at this moment because people lunge at your neck out of the fucking nowhere so why even bother just parry or chamber it.

What you people think about all this?

Knight 697 1611
  • 18 Dec '17
 das

Basically everyone agrees with everything. The only "new" topic here is lunges.

Conscript 4564 6302
  • 18 Dec '17
 vanguard

But does anyone knows what is going to be done about it? Any ideas? Did the devs said anything?

Knight 5371 7310
  • 2
  • 18 Dec '17
 Humble Staff

I feel better knowing that i am not the only one feeling that some lunges are awkward and ruin distance judging, you are either way too far to bait an attack (or to attack them out of their effective range) or you are in range of a suprisingly range increasing lunge. With long-ish weapons it really does feel like your range means shit.

Rangeception.

Knight 196 414

@Humble Staff said:
I feel better knowing that i am not the only one feeling that some lunges are awkward and ruin distance judging, you are either way too far to bait an attack (or to attack them out of their effective range) or you are in range of a suprisingly range increasing lunge. With long-ish weapons it really does feel like your range means shit.

Rangeception.

Completely agree, as a spear user.

Knight 1269 3811
  • 20 Dec '17
 Frise

what Chivalry had that made things readable was a little jerk between windup and release. This made it so that even in facehug, with the weapon literally clipping you, you could perfectly know exactly when release started and you had to parry.

In Mordhau, the weapon just kinda stars dealing damage and you have to basically guess when release is gonna start or listen to the grunt, which is not at all a reliable way to get the timing right.

Adding that little 'jerk' would fix almost all current problems with drags. I'm sure they're already doing it but ffs crush finish the fucking animations for once.

I honestly feel like everything they've done yet to 'fix' stab drags and other things that people complain about could have been fixed just by adding that little jerk.

Duke 162 274
  • 20 Dec '17
 BEACHES

@Frise said:
what Chivalry had that made things readable was a little jerk between windup and release. This made it so that even in facehug, with the weapon literally clipping you, you could perfectly know exactly when release started and you had to parry.

In Mordhau, the weapon just kinda stars dealing damage and you have to basically guess when release is gonna start or listen to the grunt, which is not at all a reliable way to get the timing right.

Adding that little 'jerk' would fix almost all current problems with drags. I'm sure they're already doing it but ffs crush finish the fucking animations for once.

I honestly feel like everything they've done yet to 'fix' stab drags and other things that people complain about could have been fixed just by adding that little jerk.

I've been yelling about this since the the alpha released. The jerkiness of chiv animations is what made it readable and very easy to see when a drag is coming. The way the weapons just kind of float around drives me absolutely insane.

Duke 2266 4010
  • 20 Dec '17
 Huggles

??? readability of drags is not the issue. Delay and accels are perfectly readable when you look at their third person mode and also use appropriate footwork.

The problem is the readability of what attack they will do in the beginning of windup. Mostly for chambers than anything else. Often times lmbs will have an animation of the guy pulling their arm back and up, making it looks like an overhead.

Or an overhead will have an animation where the guys pulls the wep across which makes you think it is an lmb, but it ends up being an overhead.

THAT is the real cause of problems. It's not the animations of a normal attack from idle, which are fine now. It is the animations from either a riposte, combo, or chamber that are the problem.

Also we need unique animations for polearms, one handers, short spear, and two handers. It looks stupid how shortspear has animations as arming sword, lol.

Duke 162 274
  • 20 Dec '17
 BEACHES

With the footdrags gone reading drags is a non-issue, I agree. That was more of an example of how most of the weapons just kind of float into you and do damage.

And yes overheads and the LMBs are the primary culprits. They blend together unless you are pretty far away from the other guy.

Duke 2266 4010
  • 20 Dec '17
 Huggles

@BEACHES said:
With the footdrags gone reading drags is a non-issue, I agree. That was more of an example of how most of the weapons just kind of float into you and do damage.

And yes overheads and the LMBs are the primary culprits. They blend together unless you are pretty far away from the other guy.

I was more addressing vanguard with that post tbh.

Conscript 4564 6302
  • 1
  • 20 Dec '17
 vanguard

@Huggles said:
??? readability of drags is not the issue. Delay and accels are perfectly readable when you look at their third person mode and also use appropriate footwork.

Not them stab drags neither last-moment drags with a few weapons. They do look pretty fucked up and I can't tell the difference, it is a true gamble on my part, specially them stabs or when I'm trying to chamber shit.

The problem is the readability of what attack they will do in the beginning of windup. Mostly for chambers than anything else. Often times lmbs will have an animation of the guy pulling their arm back and up, making it looks like an overhead.

Funny I mostly can figure where the attack will come from, this wasn't much of a problem for me. Exeption here is when the opponent looks down and does sort of a uppercut that is kind of a horizontal cut ya know. 1h weapons sometimes gives me cancer, but I don't have much problem with this really. Not that I'm saying it doesn't need to be looked at.

THAT is the real cause of problems. It's not the animations of a normal attack from idle, which are fine now. It is the animations from either a riposte, combo, or chamber that are the problem.

Also we need unique animations for polearms, one handers, short spear, and two handers. It looks stupid how shortspear has animations as arming sword, lol.

Hey this is gud idea but how will it work with the 240 system, this is imho what makes all the weapons sorta have the same animation. Like, in chiv polearms had a very distinct animation, but also the attacks came from totally different angles when you compare it with a sword. The overhead went straight down instead of making a curve, the alt-overhead was actually a uppercut, etc.

Baron 1551 2087
  • 1
  • 21 Dec '17
 yourcrippledson

what Chivalry had that made things readable was a little jerk between windup and release. This made it so that even in facehug, with the weapon literally clipping you, you could perfectly know exactly when release started and you had to parry.

I think you are looking back at chivalry with your nostalgia glasses on. When someone is good at facehugging you in chiv, it's a guessing game. Just feint or bait a parry out of them, then it is time to guess. Or wait for them to try to kick you away and just let them have it. Facehugging in chiv dominated 1v1 for many weapons. It was horrible and this game is already a better 1v1 experience imo.

As far as my thoughts on the lunges, what a lot of people are forgetting about when they complain about the state of 1v1 combat, is that it is in the process of being balanced with team combat, it would be easier to make a game like this if it was strictly 1v1, but they have to consider the overall affects on all styles of combat and gameplay. Not just consider the way you specifically duel.

Knight 1269 3811
  • 21 Dec '17
 Frise

@yourcrippledson said:
I think you are looking back at chivalry with your nostalgia glasses on.

No, you're missing the point. Chivalry is a shit game and I say it all the time. I'm pointing out one single thing that it did right. I could reliably parry just before release in Chivalry when being facehugged, and in Mordhau I can't because it's impossible to tell when release starts. I'm not talking about reading feints; It's much easier to do in Mordhau, but that is a different point all together.

Duke 5545 13265
  • 21 Dec '17
 Jax — Community Manager

I'd like to see three things in regards to the animation update

  1. angles during windup being more distinguishable
  2. transition from windup to release more apparent
  3. transition from release to recovery/combo more apparent
Conscript 4564 6302
  • 23 Dec '17
 vanguard

True that Jaxsons I agree tbh

Hey people, what do you think about the parrying animation? Sometimes I think it is kinda cancerous because I panic parry to it. Like, I attack, my opponent parryes but the parry animation looks kinda late and weird, so I panic against it.

I think I mentioned in other thread sometime ago, but since we are in the subject of animations, I think the parry animation should snap more quickly to the final moment, instead of expending so much time going everywhere. It looks kinda strange sometimes, like the opponent parryed before the animation even played, then the animation plays out of the fucking nowhere.

If you play with bots, and put it in slomo, you will notice exactly what I mean, bots parry at the very last second so it looks really funny sometimes.

2418 4910
  • 23 Dec '17
 Maci

>animation update
It's not happening, guys

Conscript 4564 6302
  • 23 Dec '17
 vanguard

Maci pls why u do this

2418 4910
  • 23 Dec '17
 Maci

My Photoshop works again!!! Time for new quality content and I won't even upload them to Imgur because PeePot lives in third world country.

Animation Update.png

Knight 528 3385
  • 30 Dec '17
 rob_owner

please make phases of attack all distinct, its not obvious enough when someone goes into recovery or when they combo atm so it gives your brain jet lag because things look too blendy and you get the impression people can parry out of recovery really fast but really you just didnt punish them soon enough because your brain didnt realize they were actually not comboing fast enough to punish them for not comboing when they miss.

Knight 2301 4168
  • 30 Dec '17
 Runagate

@rob_owner said:
please make phases of attack all distinct, its not obvious enough when someone goes into recovery or when they combo atm so it gives your brain jet lag because things look too blendy and you get the impression people can parry out of recovery really fast but really you just didnt punish them soon enough because your brain didnt realize they were actually not comboing fast enough to punish them for not comboing when they miss.

This, a million times this.