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Some Suggestions

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Before i begin, i wanted to thank the Dev's for willing to test higher acceleration rates, i think with just that, light needs no further increases in movement speed.

With that said, i think there are still some big problems with the game. I can't exactly put my finger on it, all i know is that for some reason, i just don't really feel the desire to play. Even when i win, i just don't really care all that much to be honest. It's very different where as in Chivalry, or any other game i truly enjoy. It didn't matter if i won or died, i still felt a deep enjoyment of the process, because i felt myself truly getting better, and i felt what seemed like endless possibilities of play available to me. The latter of which i think is most exciting, and is what keeps me interested in a game.

I'm also busy with real life things that i deeply care about right now, so that could just be it, but at the same time, great games make me want to think about them constantly, even when i am busy.

I believe i have some potential solutions in mind, at least somethings worth testing, and seeing how the community responds.

  • Decrease windup time, increase swing time

Some people have mentioned and complained about this before, but the windup time is considerably long, while the swing time is very short. Now i can see some potential reasons for this. But i also see and feel like it's just overall a worse system.

My reasoning for this is that, it actually feels like, at least for me, like i have less control over where my weapon is going. Which makes sense because the time where my weapon is spent moving is so short, that i don't really have the time to guide my weapon where i want it to go. Of course i could just aim my attack well during the windup and still hit a target, but i think the fun really comes from the feedback loop of seeing your weapon in the air, and moving it around in real time. I'm not entirely sure, but i think there's something to it that is far more immersive and fun than just watching a quick slash go across the screen.

  • Decrease the size of parry box

This is another issue which has been widely mentioned. The parry box is too large, specifically the width, making it very difficult if not impossible to actually reach above and around blocks. Also it's currently far too easy for someone to block an attack towards their legs.

Try testing how a significantly smaller parry box on width and height effects gameplay, and see how the community responds.

  • Implement movement based attack direction

I've first heard this suggestion mentioned by Afinity, and a number of people agreed on this as well. I currently think that the mouse movement based attack direction, is simply too unreliable. Especially when there are easier and more accurate ways to implement something like this.

As mentioned, Jedi Knight academy attack direction is determined by which direction you are moving. A for right swing, D for left swing, AW for right over head, DW for left overhead, AS for right under swing, and DS for left under swing. Stab being its own set as well. With of course the option to invert the attack patterns, if one so desires.

I think this alone could make the combat system feel so much better and more natural than it does now. It honestly doesn't even make much sense to use the mouse, because there are only 8 different cardinal directions to clash or chamber from. Also mouse movement briefly forces you to disrupt your aim to determine which attack you wish to use.

This is a relatively simple option to add to the game, and it would be far more consistent than mouse movement currently is.

This leads me to my next suggestion.

  • Allow one to attack from the same side (no comboing of course).

Currently the game automatically forces you to attack from a different side once you have already done an attack. You can override this just like in Chivalry by simply not initiating the next attack. The problem is, Mordhau's system is kinda wonky when trying to do this. It's as if it saves your past attack history for much longer than it should.

So if i am holding down A to do an attack from the right, the game should continue to attack from the right. And only start to attack from the left, when i specifically tell it to do so.

Of course one cannot combo from the same side, and will only be able to combo and as such skip windup only when you try to attack from different angles. This is of course to stop spamming from one side.

My last suggestion.

  • Fix movement in midair, and increase gravity

Currently when you jump, your character will continue to be able to change its movement fairly fluidly in any direction while in midair. Not only does this not make physical sense, i feel this disrupts gameplay. Just like in chivalry, if i jump, i will maintain movement in that direction, regardless of what i do.

I also suggest that jumps have an increase in gravity, i currently feel one stays in the air for far too long. Now i am not arguing to 'nerf' jumping, i think a person should still be able to jump just as high, and just as far, but they should come back down to the ground faster. This should actually make jumping feel tighter and more controlled.

I think the first three suggestions are of utmost importance to test. The other two are sort of nitpicks that i think would just make the overall experience better.

Hopefully we can get to test these sometime soon, thank you.

Knight 1269 3811
  • 28 Sep '17
 Frise

I don't believe release time should be extended; Noobs are already crying about drags and that aint good. At first I felt like the swing manipulation was weak but after getting used to it, you really can do a lot.

If you feel like there's nothing new for you to do, you can try pulling off difficult drags like C-Stabs, O-Stabs, Waterfalls, Wessex, and, when I upload the tutorial, the legendary Frisedrag.

The Jedi Knight thing they've mentioned they're already doing btw.

That was a good post though and I agree with slme of the points, glad you went against your bad reputation.

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@Frise said:
I don't believe release time should be extended; Noobs are already crying about drags and that aint good. At first I felt like the swing manipulation was weak but after getting used to it, you really can do a lot.

If you feel like there's nothing new for you to do, you can try pulling off difficult drags like C-Stabs, O-Stabs, Waterfalls, Wessex, and, when I upload the tutorial, the legendary Frisedrag.

The Jedi Knight thing they've mentioned they're already doing btw.

That was a good post though and I agree with slme of the points, glad you went against your bad reputation.

Hmm, maybe their complaints about the drags, is actually because the release is so fast, making it harder to judge the timing.

I don't know.. just a thought.

Next time i get online i'll try some of your suggestions as well.

Knight 936 952
  • 28 Sep '17
 afiNity

I think you got some really good suggestions.

@roshawnmarcellterrell said:
As mentioned, Jedi Knight academy attack direction is determined by which direction you are moving. A for right swing, D for left swing, AW for right over head, DW for left overhead, AS for right under swing, and DS for left under swing. Stab being its own set as well. With of course the option to invert the attack patterns, if one so desires.

In JK it's actually the opposite (A = swing to the left etc). Stab could be W imo.
For fun I switched the look/turn from the mouse to the wasd keys. Obviously you can't play like that but was still fun to mess around with that a bit.

Knight 2307 4188
  • 28 Sep '17
 Runagate

@roshawnmarcellter said:
Also mouse movement briefly forces you to disrupt your aim to determine which attack you wish to use.

You only have to move your mouse a few pixels for it to register. Good post other than that though!

Baron 135 244
  • 28 Sep '17
 EvilSuD

These are some great suggestions and I agree with all of them.

Emperor 400 927
  • 1
  • 28 Sep '17
 Soulcatcher

@roshawnmarcellterrell said:
With that said, i think there are still some big problems with the game. I can't exactly put my finger on it, all i know is that for some reason, i just don't really feel the desire to play. Even when i win, i just don't really care all that much to be honest. It's very different where as in Chivalry, or any other game i truly enjoy. It didn't matter if i won or died, i still felt a deep enjoyment of the process, because i felt myself truly getting better, and i felt what seemed like endless possibilities of play available to me. The latter of which i think is most exciting, and is what keeps me interested in a game.

You're not the only person feeling this way. But honestly a simple explanation is the fact the game doesn't have any depth beyond the core game mechanics.

You make a character with different pieces of armour, there is no perks or benefits for light or medium beyond a recent movement speed increase which tbh isn't worth the damage reduction of heavy armour. Just choose heavy armour.

So you pick heavy armour, decorate your character a bit. Pick a weapon and go into a game mode where you just have to kill that or those guys. That's essentially what the alpha offers right now. That's fine, the games playable, enjoyable, unpredictable, but you just have to go kill that guy.

Wait till we have more interesting game modes, balanced weapons, balanced speeds, more armour, more weapons, horses, throw your pommel, the proficency system that gives you perks based on your armour etc, gold... buying better weapons and armour, achievements, cosmetics. VOICE COMMANDS. Modded servers, modded game modes. Hell once the speeds and weapons are balanced, the proficency system is added, there will probably be real use to using the alternate grips on weapons too.

Like just literally look at all those things, I can't be bothered playing more than a few hours of Mordhau compared to my all fking night Chivalry agatha archer voice spamming binges, but the love and addiction will grow once some of these mechanics and fixes are put into place.

Some people like grinding achievements, maybe you unlock a cosmetic item for 1000 longsword kills, 5000? that'd keep me playing, I'd feel like I'm slowly achieving not only the kill requirements for the unlock but I would also be becoming very proficient with that particular weapon, it's range, how many hits it takes to kill people with a certain armour type on a body part etc.

It's gonna be good

I'm drunk I don't know what I'm even replying to anymore

Z4im1NE.gif

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@Soulcatcher said:

@roshawnmarcellterrell said:
With that said, i think there are still some big problems with the game. I can't exactly put my finger on it, all i know is that for some reason, i just don't really feel the desire to play. Even when i win, i just don't really care all that much to be honest. It's very different where as in Chivalry, or any other game i truly enjoy. It didn't matter if i won or died, i still felt a deep enjoyment of the process, because i felt myself truly getting better, and i felt what seemed like endless possibilities of play available to me. The latter of which i think is most exciting, and is what keeps me interested in a game.

You're not the only person feeling this way. But honestly a simple explanation is the fact the game doesn't have any depth beyond the core game mechanics.

You make a character with different pieces of armour, there is no perks or benefits for light or medium beyond a recent movement speed increase which tbh isn't worth the damage reduction of heavy armour. Just choose heavy armour.

So you pick heavy armour, decorate your character a bit. Pick a weapon and go into a game mode where you just have to kill that or those guys. That's essentially what the alpha offers right now. That's fine, the games playable, enjoyable, unpredictable, but you just have to go kill that guy.

Wait till we have more interesting game modes, balanced weapons, balanced speeds, more armour, more weapons, horses, throw your pommel, the proficency system that gives you perks based on your armour etc, gold... buying better weapons and armour, achievements, cosmetics. VOICE COMMANDS. Modded servers, modded game modes. Hell once the speeds and weapons are balanced, the proficency system is added, there will probably be real use to using the alternate grips on weapons too.

Like just literally look at all those things, I can't be bothered playing more than a few hours of Mordhau compared to my all fking night Chivalry agatha archer voice spamming binges, but the love and addiction will grow once some of these mechanics and fixes are put into place.

Some people like grinding achievements, maybe you unlock a cosmetic item for 1000 longsword kills, 5000? that'd keep me playing, I'd feel like I'm slowly achieving not only the kill requirements for the unlock but I would also be becoming very proficient with that particular weapon, it's range, how many hits it takes to kill people with a certain armour type on a body part etc.

It's gonna be good

I'm drunk I don't know what I'm even replying to anymore

Z4im1NE.gif

I see what you're saying, and i definitely agree to at least some extent.

But, all i really do in Chivalry is duelyard and play slaughterhouse LTS every now and then.
I've dueled consistently for 8 hour binges, sometimes the same person such as Alice over and over and over again for hours.
Even though i dueled Alice for 2-3 hours straight, and i died probably over 150 times, but only won like 10 times (most of which were luck). It was still incredibly fun.

I want to feel that with Mordhau.. Hell i want to feel that with any game, but just about every game feels empty to me now.

Knight 936 952
  • 28 Sep '17
 afiNity

I feel the same tbh.
I'm not sure if that's the explanation but when it comes to combat, maybe the game is currently relying too much on certain mechanics like feint, riposte, chamber, while being pretty restrictive about footwork, turncap and so on. The game feels like a reaction test atm. Blocks being very powerful also plays a role in that.

Emperor 400 927
  • 28 Sep '17
 Soulcatcher

The whole every game feels empty, I can definately relate. Chivalry has for years been the apex of the skill based melee genre ( practically nonexistent ) and the only game I've sunk 2k hours into and the only game I can ever play now. The thing with Chiv though is it's silly, hilarious, and the mechanics aren't so difficult to grasp but difficult to master, it's not HARD to LEARN how to block a drag or an accel, you KNOW how to do it, and KNOW when it's probably about to happen. But it's that whole mind game, it's never been a complete twitch fest.

Sure it's the same in Mord, but with a fuck load of other ways to throw people off. Sure you might read a feint, but at least to me it's the speed of weapons and releases that screws me over, sometimes it feels unbalanced, which in regards to some weapons it is. But maybe it's simply because it's a new game, with a whole new set of rules. It's foreign and might feel shallow in some ways, hopefully it'll get even better.

  • 28 Sep '17
 DukeNukem
This comment was deleted.
Duke 5558 13284
  • 28 Sep '17
 Jax — Community Manager

When you played CMW, did you consistently join servers full of melee vets with thousands of hours each in the game?
I didn't, and that's why Mordhau feels much harder to me - the skill level is artificially raised due to all the melee gods.

Also, currently there isn't a lot of context to the game, since there's 0 objectives and all the game modes focus around "kill the dudes" right now.

As for footwork, I've been pulling off matrixes and torso leans like it's cool - last night I dodged a swing just by casually flicking my mouse in the right direction while winding up an attack. In regards to WASD footwork=, everyone is currently running around in plate, so it's going to be a little difficult until there's a reason to not use plate - right now, plate guys with zweis and halberds kind of negate that movement speed bonus you'd get with light armor.

TLDR - it gon be gud, dis an alpha (meant for testing)

  • 28 Sep '17
 DukeNukem
This comment was deleted.
Duke 5558 13284
  • 28 Sep '17
 Jax — Community Manager

analgrinder just because you pledged on kickstarter doesn't mean that the entire game will be changed to fit your desires. A lot more people don't want hit trading and a lot of those people paid more than you did.

  • 28 Sep '17
 DukeNukem
This comment was deleted.
Knight 256 264
  • 28 Sep '17
 CrimsonKing

@DukeNukem said:
Ye and if the game dies, will die because of frustrating gameplay and of lack of options to satisfy the players who want a game more realistic and fun.

"Satisfy the players"

You mean yourself.

Mercenary 1897 7067
  • 28 Sep '17
 ThunderDuck

You just won't quit will you?

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@Jax said:
When you played CMW, did you consistently join servers full of melee vets with thousands of hours each in the game?
I didn't, and that's why Mordhau feels much harder to me - the skill level is artificially raised due to all the melee gods.

Also, currently there isn't a lot of context to the game, since there's 0 objectives and all the game modes focus around "kill the dudes" right now.

As for footwork, I've been pulling off matrixes and torso leans like it's cool - last night I dodged a swing just by casually flicking my mouse in the right direction while winding up an attack. In regards to WASD footwork=, everyone is currently running around in plate, so it's going to be a little difficult until there's a reason to not use plate - right now, plate guys with zweis and halberds kind of negate that movement speed bonus you'd get with light armor.

TLDR - it gon be gud, dis an alpha (meant for testing)

As i said before to soulcatcher, i fight players such as Alice, consistently, and for many hours at a time.

Duchess 806 3550
Knight 1269 3811
  • 28 Sep '17
 Frise

@Stouty said:
meme

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